Inverted sealed vs regular sealed

[///M5 2,833]

Assuming you corrected for the box volume so the inverted sub and normal mounting each had the "optimal" enclosure volume the differences would not be audible.

The cone shape in this case couldn't really affect the wave. The angle is really the same inverted / \ = \ / and the motor structure is only nominally in the way and not at all when you consider the length of sub frequencies so it can't create that much extra destructive interference (less than 100Hz is more than 10')

I am sure the difference is electronically measurable and "noticeable" in some realm (like an in an anechoic chamber) but really isn't auditory nor repeatably measureable with a measurement mic in a standard room environment.

[Tirefryr 1,742]

But how does the shape of the cone affect the waveform? I'm not understanding that.

[Supa_c 1]

O.K fellas....

Dennisp and myself are making enclosures for his 2 Kicker Solobaric 8's ( round cones)

We have serious depth issues.

So our 2 options are to build out from what the enclosure is or Invert.

Now, the Solobaric has rather small openings on the magnet. A lot smaller than a RE8. You cant even stick your finger in the holes.

It seems like there isnt enough open area for the air to move through.

Should we even bother worring about this ?

[Tirefryr 1,742]

O.K fellas....

Dennisp and myself are making enclosures for his 2 Kicker Solobaric 8's ( round cones)

We have serious depth issues.

So our 2 options are to build out from what the enclosure is or Invert.

Now, the Solobaric has rather small openings on the magnet. A lot smaller than a RE8. You cant even stick your finger in the holes.

It seems like there isnt enough open area for the air to move through.

Should we even bother worring about this ?

I ran my solo 8s in .33 cubes each. The enclosure was just large enough to fit the driver and nothing more. The actual spacing between the pole vent and the wall was no more than 1/2", probably less, but I remember being worried about it. Never caused a problem. I beat the hell out of them with an A600 mono and they never once screamed.

[///M5 2,833]

But how does the shape of the cone affect the waveform?  I'm not understanding that.

As I said in my previous post it will be inaudible, especially in a car but if by shape of the cone you mean angle or surface features it would only cause a little phase shift. It is sort of the same problem you have if you move your tweeter and mid a ways away from each other only it is happening on a much smaller scale. If your cone has enough of a slant to give you say a 1" difference the sound wave propagating from that spot on the cone will have a 1" headstart or have a 1" phase difference than a wave propagating from the center of the speaker. At a frequency with a wavelength of 36" it would be a 10 degree phase difference, on a frequency with a wavelength of 2" it would be a 180 degree phase difference and so on. Of course this was simplified for the example as sound waves will travel in all directions and as it propogates from its point source and there will be interference from all of the waves, but again your not going to hear this.

[dennisp 0]

O.K fellas....

Dennisp and myself are making enclosures for his 2 Kicker Solobaric 8's ( round cones)

We have serious depth issues.

So our 2 options are to build out from what the enclosure is or Invert.

Now, the Solobaric has rather small openings on the magnet. A lot smaller than a RE8. You cant even stick your finger in the holes.

It seems like there isnt enough open area for the air to move through.

Should we even bother worring about this ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I ran my solo 8s in .33 cubes each. The enclosure was just large enough to fit the driver and nothing more. The actual spacing between the pole vent and the wall was no more than 1/2", probably less, but I remember being worried about it. Never caused a problem. I beat the hell out of them with an A600 mono and they never once screamed.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Our whole dilemma is depth, which seems to keep us from regular mounting the subs. My question is, do you think they'll sound good inverted? It seems like a lot of the sub's frame/magnet would block the soundwaves.

[Tirefryr 1,742]

But how does the shape of the cone affect the waveform?

[Tirefryr 1,742]

O.K fellas....

Dennisp and myself are making enclosures for his 2 Kicker Solobaric 8's ( round cones)

We have serious depth issues.

So our 2 options are to build out from what the enclosure is or Invert.

Now, the Solobaric has rather small openings on the magnet. A lot smaller than a RE8. You cant even stick your finger in the holes.

It seems like there isnt enough open area for the air to move through.

Should we even bother worring about this ?

I ran my solo 8s in .33 cubes each. The enclosure was just large enough to fit the driver and nothing more. The actual spacing between the pole vent and the wall was no more than 1/2", probably less, but I remember being worried about it. Never caused a problem. I beat the hell out of them with an A600 mono and they never once screamed.

Our whole dilemma is depth, which seems to keep us from regular mounting the subs. My question is, do you think they'll sound good inverted? It seems like a lot of the sub's frame/magnet would block the soundwaves.

It doesn't work like that. The omnidirectional waves don't act the same. Does downfiring a driver affect the "sound" of the bass when it's firing at a floor?

I know your problem is depth, but do you just no have enough or do you, but you're worried about blocking the pole vent?

[dennisp 0]

I know your problem is depth, but do you just no have enough or do you, but you're worried about blocking the pole vent?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We would have damn near none if we regular mounted, and that's after adding an extra baffle. The problem with that is I'd have to make a new grill for the door panel. The other option is inverting, where the butt end would be sticking out of the doorpanel. This is all in the rear btw where the stock rear fill used to be.

[///M5 2,833]

But just to better understand your explanation, by the waveform changing you mean just the phase correct?  With soundwaves, they don't have different waveforms like voltage does, correct?

Not quite sure I understand you question, so this might answer it. Both are sinusoidal waves with 360 degrees of phase. By summing the sinusoidal waves you can make any waveshape that your speaker plays back including square waves--just like a voltage wave. To simplify my description above, think of using a test CD with just a 1kHz test tone on it and that it will be coming from not just the center of the cone but the whole cone surface. With a sine wave (voltage) driving the speaker it creates a disturbance in the air and makes a acoustic wave if you imagine you are playing a sine tone on infinite repeat from anyone spot on the speaker it will go through a full 360 degrees before repeating itself. Since the speaker cone isn't flat there will be a different distance to a target (mic) from each different spot on the cone so the wave will arrive at a different times. Since there is a little delay and the frequencies were created at the same time it will have to arrive at a different spot in the phase of the wave..

[///M5 2,833]

Oh, I'd probably make a new grill as it will be the slickest option, but they will sound just fine inverted.

[Supa_c 1]

1/2" is pushing it with the baffle.

you cant fit a finger behind there

[Tirefryr 1,742]

But just to better understand your explanation, by the waveform changing you mean just the phase correct?

[///M5 2,833]

That's exactly what I was looking for.  Thank you!

Your welcome. How are they lookin' Supa?

[Supa_c 1]

They sounded like absolute crap inverted.

So much mechanical noise.

We made a 3/4" baffle and mounted them normally, didnt get a chance to hear them that way though

[///M5 2,833]

They sounded like absolute crap inverted.

So much mechanical noise.

We made a 3/4" baffle and mounted them normally, didnt get a chance to hear them that way though

That sucks, did you have to do custom grills then too?

[Supa_c 1]

We didnt have enough time to make grills.

[///M5 2,833]

hehe, ya I bought mine from Madisound for the same reason