78 replies to this topic

[CrownVic]

Well my car used a ford 6g alt as well, and I enjoy soldering so im going to try this when I get the chance. What kind of diode did you use? Did it help you voltage out at all with your system up?

[MECHMAN]

Great to have you here!

Hi Mark. We will be taking care of the rest of this deal we have going tomorrow. Got to get the Jeep done today!

Glad to see you Eric Nothing wrong with knowledgeable advice. I did call Matt before you actively started helping forum wise. He told me everything was fine but honestly I adjusted the POT down to 14.9v cold start at night and when I received the bracket I squeezed in the belt I called you for and things have been great since.

Welcome to SSA Eric

Glad we could help. Just a little belt slip can cause problems, makes it impossible to have stable voltage.




If this mod works properly on 6G units then go for it, but make sure you have a voltmeter in the car so you know what it does cold, hot, driving, and under high load. I would hate to see someone smoke their alternator or battery or worse, their PCM by overcharging.


Glad to be here, looking forward to getting to know you all better.

[grandprixpunch]

60 seconds, plugged in the harness, 14.9 volts. Worth the $22!

[djjdnap]

4g and 6g alts look the same to me


and CrownVic

http://www.radioshac...oductId=2062591

these were the diodes i used.

[MECHMAN]

That's up to you to determine, but that "Sensing and switching circuits" section is the one to look at, the problem is in there on many of the 4G. While they look the same on paper the circuitry is not the same in the regulator. Also, don't forget that there are several regulators available.

Which Crown Vic? My 03 isn't like that at all.

[ford302redneck]

lol dont take offense jeez im a big DIY guy the making products myself was all in humor. I dont have time for that.

1.the voltage isn't going to go past 15.1v, since the voltage drop is only .6-.7v
2. Yes the pcm controlled alts are different, not my problem
3.If you would have read correctly its adjusting your TPS sensor, there is no way to adjust a IAC in the first place.

The optimim setting is .99 by loosening the 2 screws you can pivot the sensor ever so slightly. The object is to NOT exceed .99 although it usually comes from the factory way over that like 1.3 or under at .891 once you get it as close to .99 as you can the better the idle and response
--------------------------------------------
Try to get just below .99 It is all about idle smoothness and throttle response. NOT hp. Now that you've done it once it will be a snap to go out and get it below .99 say .989 or so. Some people have had to elongate the holes a hair to get it since Ford doesn't take the time to dial it in. This will really smoth out the idle issues many have and since the computer knows the exact location and position of the throttle blade the response is really noticable. So many people think it is BS or expect a major deal, but it's the little things that pay off. All it takes is a little time.

i can take the pic down, your product wasnt the basis of this thread when it first started, but my opinion got intertwined somewhere along the way.
so like i said dont take any offense, most ppl are too lazy to go out and figure things like this out anyway and would rather be able to plug and go about there business.

Yeah, I never said anything adjusting throttle blade set screw. Then act like I'm missinforming people, HaHa.

Also, I'd like to say, as long as the picture is used for education and discussing purpose, usually isn't a copyright problem, so therefore doesn't need permissions. Maybe somebody need to learn copyright law a little better. Also, it was made clear that it was Mechman's product, not like somebody was using it for their own gain.

a

[MECHMAN]

lol dont take offense jeez im a big DIY guy the making products myself was all in humor. I dont have time for that.

1.the voltage isn't going to go past 15.1v, since the voltage drop is only .6-.7v
2. Yes the pcm controlled alts are different, not my problem
3.If you would have read correctly its adjusting your TPS sensor, there is no way to adjust a IAC in the first place.

The optimim setting is .99 by loosening the 2 screws you can pivot the sensor ever so slightly. The object is to NOT exceed .99 although it usually comes from the factory way over that like 1.3 or under at .891 once you get it as close to .99 as you can the better the idle and response
--------------------------------------------
Try to get just below .99 It is all about idle smoothness and throttle response. NOT hp. Now that you've done it once it will be a snap to go out and get it below .99 say .989 or so. Some people have had to elongate the holes a hair to get it since Ford doesn't take the time to dial it in. This will really smoth out the idle issues many have and since the computer knows the exact location and position of the throttle blade the response is really noticable. So many people think it is BS or expect a major deal, but it's the little things that pay off. All it takes is a little time.

i can take the pic down, your product wasnt the basis of this thread when it first started, but my opinion got intertwined somewhere along the way.
so like i said dont take any offense, most ppl are too lazy to go out and figure things like this out anyway and would rather be able to plug and go about there business.

Yeah, I never said anything adjusting throttle blade set screw. Then act like I'm missinforming people, HaHa.

Also, I'd like to say, as long as the picture is used for education and discussing purpose, usually isn't a copyright problem, so therefore doesn't need permissions. Maybe somebody need to learn copyright law a little better. Also, it was made clear that it was Mechman's product, not like somebody was using it for their own gain.

a

Someone mentioned something about an 8mm wrench, you use that to adjust the throttle plate, not the TPS. Maybe I misread, maybe not, but you did mention idle problems?
As for adjusting the TPS to control your idle, that may or may not have a good result for you with Ford EECIV or Ford EECV system. Having owned several, raced many and built countless EECIV controlled cars I have a little experience in this. If I misunderstood what you were trying to do here excuse me for trying to help. You mentioned continual idle problems, did you fix them?

What kind of problem are you having with your Ford? I can help quite a bit as I spent thousands of hours under the hood of Mustangs building, tuning and racing them. I usually have at least on Ford as a DD, right now it's a Crown Vic PI, but Mustangs are my thing.


The picture is of my product and was used in a discussion covering how to adjust voltage. Did I say that it was a copyright issue? This thread was going down the path of dissecting my product and building more for profit. When people start talking about building their own and my product is pictured why don't you talk to your lawyer about how that works. I have said that the design should be your own, not my design, nothing about copyright or even better, PATENT law. The photo isn't copyrighted but have you checked for a patent on the design?

The idea of being able to raise charging voltage is good, using resistance in the sense circuit is the way to do it, but not all regulators work the same even in the same model alternator. In that respect I am just trying to keep some of you from having issues by trying to add resistance. Some regulators will have batt voltage going to the sense lead in the plug but will not read from there, they will read from inside the regulator. By adding resistance to the sense lead in that type of unit you will either create a constant fluctuation in the voltage or no adjustment. Some will trigger battery warning lights. On some units they changed the pin they used for sensing. Variables in the Ford 3G/4G/6G alternators are so many that I can't even remember them all. We have a solution for the units that can't be externally adjusted, it's more than a plug-in harness. We also have a protection in our design to prevent catastrophic overcharging.

I'm not saying to not add resistors, just be cautious when doing this so you don't create problems in your charging system.

Edited by MECHMAN, 25 June 2011 - 05:46 PM.

[ford302redneck]

lol dont take offense jeez im a big DIY guy the making products myself was all in humor. I dont have time for that.

1.the voltage isn't going to go past 15.1v, since the voltage drop is only .6-.7v
2. Yes the pcm controlled alts are different, not my problem
3.If you would have read correctly its adjusting your TPS sensor, there is no way to adjust a IAC in the first place.

The optimim setting is .99 by loosening the 2 screws you can pivot the sensor ever so slightly. The object is to NOT exceed .99 although it usually comes from the factory way over that like 1.3 or under at .891 once you get it as close to .99 as you can the better the idle and response
--------------------------------------------
Try to get just below .99 It is all about idle smoothness and throttle response. NOT hp. Now that you've done it once it will be a snap to go out and get it below .99 say .989 or so. Some people have had to elongate the holes a hair to get it since Ford doesn't take the time to dial it in. This will really smoth out the idle issues many have and since the computer knows the exact location and position of the throttle blade the response is really noticable. So many people think it is BS or expect a major deal, but it's the little things that pay off. All it takes is a little time.

i can take the pic down, your product wasnt the basis of this thread when it first started, but my opinion got intertwined somewhere along the way.
so like i said dont take any offense, most ppl are too lazy to go out and figure things like this out anyway and would rather be able to plug and go about there business.

Yeah, I never said anything adjusting throttle blade set screw. Then act like I'm missinforming people, HaHa.

Also, I'd like to say, as long as the picture is used for education and discussing purpose, usually isn't a copyright problem, so therefore doesn't need permissions. Maybe somebody need to learn copyright law a little better. Also, it was made clear that it was Mechman's product, not like somebody was using it for their own gain.

a

Someone mentioned something about an 8mm wrench, you use that to adjust the throttle plate, not the TPS. Maybe I misread, maybe not, but you did mention idle problems?
As for adjusting the TPS to control your idle, that may or may not have a good result for you with Ford EECIV or Ford EECV system. Having owned several, raced many and built countless EECIV controlled cars I have a little experience in this. If I misunderstood what you were trying to do here excuse me for trying to help. You mentioned continual idle problems, did you fix them?

What kind of problem are you having with your Ford? I can help quite a bit as I spent thousands of hours under the hood of Mustangs building, tuning and racing them. I usually have at least on Ford as a DD, right now it's a Crown Vic PI, but Mustangs are my thing.


The picture is of my product and was used in a discussion covering how to adjust voltage. Did I say that it was a copyright issue? This thread was going down the path of dissecting my product and building more for profit. When people start talking about building their own and my product is pictured why don't you talk to your lawyer about how that works. I have said that the design should be your own, not my design, nothing about copyright or even better, PATENT law. The photo isn't copyrighted but have you checked for a patent on the design?

The idea of being able to raise charging voltage is good, using resistance in the sense circuit is the way to do it, but not all regulators work the same even in the same model alternator. In that respect I am just trying to keep some of you from having issues by trying to add resistance. Some regulators will have batt voltage going to the sense lead in the plug but will not read from there, they will read from inside the regulator. By adding resistance to the sense lead in that type of unit you will either create a constant fluctuation in the voltage or no adjustment. Some will trigger battery warning lights. On some units they changed the pin they used for sensing. Variables in the Ford 3G/4G/6G alternators are so many that I can't even remember them all. We have a solution for the units that can't be externally adjusted, it's more than a plug-in harness. We also have a protection in our design to prevent catastrophic overcharging.

I'm not saying to not add resistors, just be cautious when doing this so you don't create problems in your charging system.

But nobody directly said ANYTHING about copying your product exactly. Actually MLA was brought up in the post where the guy said I should start making My own. Unless your product works the same way as the topic of this thread, I doubt he was going to copy your design.

Regardless, if you think its nessacercy, I'd like to see a lawsuit stick against the guy that posted your product. But still, this thread wasn't going down any path desecting your product to make profit.

So your saying, if I noticed a niche market for a certain product, I can't use another companies product as a inspiration to do my own thing? I think everybody has done that at some point. Just because they don't public state it, doesn't mean they don't.

I just think you went off a little early raving about people stealing your product.

To the TPS topic, I still never said adjust the throttle blade set screw. I think I actually said that it wasn't that one to make sure nobody would get confused. And yes, I've tried messing with my TPS cause of a hanging idle problem. That's why you rev up the engine, and the RPMs drop normal until 1500ish, and hangs for a few seconds then drops back to normal idle. And I explained why I had problems in my other post on page 2? I have a overwound HO alt with underdrive pullies that doesn't put hardly anything at the right TPS voltage. And you adjust the tps voltage by adjusting a allen screw on the side of the TB. It has a little hole that allows air to get past the blade when its shut, therefore changing your idle.

I have a 94 Mustang GT. And these had different TB than any other 5.0, so if you haven't messed with one, that might be why you didn't understand the screw part.

[MECHMAN]

lol dont take offense jeez im a big DIY guy the making products myself was all in humor. I dont have time for that.

1.the voltage isn't going to go past 15.1v, since the voltage drop is only .6-.7v
2. Yes the pcm controlled alts are different, not my problem
3.If you would have read correctly its adjusting your TPS sensor, there is no way to adjust a IAC in the first place.

The optimim setting is .99 by loosening the 2 screws you can pivot the sensor ever so slightly. The object is to NOT exceed .99 although it usually comes from the factory way over that like 1.3 or under at .891 once you get it as close to .99 as you can the better the idle and response
--------------------------------------------
Try to get just below .99 It is all about idle smoothness and throttle response. NOT hp. Now that you've done it once it will be a snap to go out and get it below .99 say .989 or so. Some people have had to elongate the holes a hair to get it since Ford doesn't take the time to dial it in. This will really smoth out the idle issues many have and since the computer knows the exact location and position of the throttle blade the response is really noticable. So many people think it is BS or expect a major deal, but it's the little things that pay off. All it takes is a little time.

i can take the pic down, your product wasnt the basis of this thread when it first started, but my opinion got intertwined somewhere along the way.
so like i said dont take any offense, most ppl are too lazy to go out and figure things like this out anyway and would rather be able to plug and go about there business.

Yeah, I never said anything adjusting throttle blade set screw. Then act like I'm missinforming people, HaHa.

Also, I'd like to say, as long as the picture is used for education and discussing purpose, usually isn't a copyright problem, so therefore doesn't need permissions. Maybe somebody need to learn copyright law a little better. Also, it was made clear that it was Mechman's product, not like somebody was using it for their own gain.

a

Someone mentioned something about an 8mm wrench, you use that to adjust the throttle plate, not the TPS. Maybe I misread, maybe not, but you did mention idle problems?
As for adjusting the TPS to control your idle, that may or may not have a good result for you with Ford EECIV or Ford EECV system. Having owned several, raced many and built countless EECIV controlled cars I have a little experience in this. If I misunderstood what you were trying to do here excuse me for trying to help. You mentioned continual idle problems, did you fix them?

What kind of problem are you having with your Ford? I can help quite a bit as I spent thousands of hours under the hood of Mustangs building, tuning and racing them. I usually have at least on Ford as a DD, right now it's a Crown Vic PI, but Mustangs are my thing.


The picture is of my product and was used in a discussion covering how to adjust voltage. Did I say that it was a copyright issue? This thread was going down the path of dissecting my product and building more for profit. When people start talking about building their own and my product is pictured why don't you talk to your lawyer about how that works. I have said that the design should be your own, not my design, nothing about copyright or even better, PATENT law. The photo isn't copyrighted but have you checked for a patent on the design?

The idea of being able to raise charging voltage is good, using resistance in the sense circuit is the way to do it, but not all regulators work the same even in the same model alternator. In that respect I am just trying to keep some of you from having issues by trying to add resistance. Some regulators will have batt voltage going to the sense lead in the plug but will not read from there, they will read from inside the regulator. By adding resistance to the sense lead in that type of unit you will either create a constant fluctuation in the voltage or no adjustment. Some will trigger battery warning lights. On some units they changed the pin they used for sensing. Variables in the Ford 3G/4G/6G alternators are so many that I can't even remember them all. We have a solution for the units that can't be externally adjusted, it's more than a plug-in harness. We also have a protection in our design to prevent catastrophic overcharging.

I'm not saying to not add resistors, just be cautious when doing this so you don't create problems in your charging system.

But nobody directly said ANYTHING about copying your product exactly. Actually MLA was brought up in the post where the guy said I should start making My own. Unless your product works the same way as the topic of this thread, I doubt he was going to copy your design.

Regardless, if you think its nessacercy, I'd like to see a lawsuit stick against the guy that posted your product. But still, this thread wasn't going down any path desecting your product to make profit.

So your saying, if I noticed a niche market for a certain product, I can't use another companies product as a inspiration to do my own thing? I think everybody has done that at some point. Just because they don't public state it, doesn't mean they don't.

I just think you went off a little early raving about people stealing your product.

To the TPS topic, I still never said adjust the throttle blade set screw. I think I actually said that it wasn't that one to make sure nobody would get confused. And yes, I've tried messing with my TPS cause of a hanging idle problem. That's why you rev up the engine, and the RPMs drop normal until 1500ish, and hangs for a few seconds then drops back to normal idle. And I explained why I had problems in my other post on page 2? I have a overwound HO alt with underdrive pullies that doesn't put hardly anything at the right TPS voltage. And you adjust the tps voltage by adjusting a allen screw on the side of the TB. It has a little hole that allows air to get past the blade when its shut, therefore changing your idle.

I have a 94 Mustang GT. And these had different TB than any other 5.0, so if you haven't messed with one, that might be why you didn't understand the screw part.

I'm done with the conversation about my product at this point, I didn't come in here threatening to sue or anything like that. I also didn't say anyone was stealing my product, just warned against it. Now that there has been some creative editing things read a little different in this thread. I'm not worried about that anyway, I'm sure the lawyer could deal with that easily if the need was to arise. I'm not the type that goes around suing people or pushing them around with threats.

The 94 Mustang isn't the only model with an air bypass on the throttle body, I am familiar with it's setting. Adsjusting the air bypass will alter will confuse the system if it's too far out of spec. The factory parameter for the air volume at idle at a given TPS voltage determines the position of the IAC. You can allow more air past with that screw but at the closed-throttle TPS voltage it can cause a lean conditon and an idle surge. It will pick up when leaned out, the IAC tries to lower it, drops down, IAC tries to return to programmed position, idle picks up again. EECIV isn't the smartest EFI, I have been there with this problem in the past.

Are you running a stock throttle body? What modifications have you done to the engine?

[An-i-no]

I have no part of this argument but wtf Redneck? When did it become a good idea to argue with the guy about lawsuits? He came to inform people that the info that was being passed around was potentially dangerous to the vehicle. Now...how did that incite an argumentative response on your part?

[djjdnap]

Im not sure how this whole thread became an argument in the first place...
well i know why, but that is besides the point.

With any mod you assume the risk, I merely found the info about the mod on another site and shared it here.
The original website has nothing to do with ford alternators, i only posted that image because thats the alt i have.

Furthermore as stated no one is trying to make money off of taking anyones idea.

If that was the case it would be as simple as "reverse Engineering" the product.

Patents are not private on designs anyway, most times they only have a certain amount of years before they run out.
after that they are usually fair game to other manufacturers.


Im not 100% sure on that info but i know that i am in the ball park..

If you guys want to argue please take it else where.

Edited by djjdnap, 27 June 2011 - 10:51 PM.

[djjdnap]

The 94 Mustang isn't the only model with an air bypass on the throttle body, I am familiar with it's setting. Adsjusting the air bypass will alter will confuse the system if it's too far out of spec. The factory parameter for the air volume at idle at a given TPS voltage determines the position of the IAC. You can allow more air past with that screw but at the closed-throttle TPS voltage it can cause a lean conditon and an idle surge. It will pick up when leaned out, the IAC tries to lower it, drops down, IAC tries to return to programmed position, idle picks up again. EECIV isn't the smartest EFI, I have been there with this problem in the past.

Are you running a stock throttle body? What modifications have you done to the engine?

Only mod i have is a custom intake on a 5.4 triton.

The issues i had where high and low idle, and it turned out to be a vacuum leak.
I also replaced my IAC because it was gunked up.

So there are no problems as of now, except the idle is low, so voltage is low..

His suggestion was to adjust the TPS sensor

[MECHMAN]

You may be able to pick up the idle by adjusting the TPS sensor, there is a small range of adjustment there.

What is your current idle speed? Is it lower than the MFG setting or is it just below the turn-on speed of your alternator?

[ford302redneck]

Mechman.

I never said anything like you didn't have the right to protect your product. I just felt you came into here raving prematurely about people coping your product, when I don't think anybody had the intentions. I know I didn't anyways, I even stated your product was different than the topic, and that's why it cost more. But I still don't see grounds for a lawsuit, if you decided that's what you wanted to do. Even though I'm not involved in the legal system and don't know all the laws and such. I mean you can try to sue over anything, but winning is another thing.

To the Throttle part, I was trying to bring my idle down, because it would hang at ~1800RPM, and get set at 1200RPM(I can't remember the exact idle before hand, been a while since I've messed with the car.). Found a topic on hanging idle, and it advised to check TPS voltage. I did and it wasn't with end the correct voltage. So I adjusted it, and when I got to a certain point, my voltage would drop to 12. And it would idle super low. And if I turned it up a little, it would hang at 1200. So it was either hang and idle at 1200, or idle low with no hanging idle.

In this topic, I was just suggested checking TPS instead of "pulling a vacuum line" as the poster stated.

Also, I didn't edit any of my posts, so if your talking about me, you must of got something confused. Well, I take that back, somebody else could of edited mine, I haven't went back and read all of mine.

[djjdnap]

So now that everything is cleared up..