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rustydawwg

I need some input

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Holy Hell, some people just have no common sense.

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There is a plethora of information on this forum. How you take it is on you. Maybe questions need to be specific because the issues are in your driveway, and we are on the internet. It would be much different if we were in your driveway to SEE it with our own eyes. Getting information is asking a precise question to get a precise answer. Cause and effect. 

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Holy Hell, some people just have no common sense.

 

 

There is a plethora of information on this forum. How you take it is on you. Maybe questions need to be specific because the issues are in your driveway, and we are on the internet. It would be much different if we were in your driveway to SEE it with our own eyes. Getting information is asking a precise question to get a precise answer. Cause and effect. 

 

I guess i'm just trying to say that he comes across as an ass in a nice way.- nothing against that member, 

I have a good point - if he's giving advice to so many people its important to be as diplomatic as possible. 

 

And yes, i am working on my question asking skills. i fully admit that i have my own set of problems lol

 

And a picture does allow you to see btw

 

We need to move this conversation somewhere else or end it -

were hijacking this thread- back to the topic of Single- sub 1500 watt SPL setups wink.png

Edited by Trent Hari

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I also have a JL Audio amp , and I am also having trouble with blowing sub-woofers that should not blow on my amp. ( I blew a Alpine type R and i have a SA-12 that im needing to baby along) Maybe you should look in the JL audio forums and see if JL amps have a bad reputation for being hard on sub-woofers that are not made by JL. ( I wouldn't be surprised) .

 

You probably should check for amplifier clipping also.

Congratulations on the Xcon by the way smile.png

Seriously? SERIOUSLY? 

tumblr_mkc32iJX4V1rjhbn2o1_400.gif

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eggyhustles, on 18 May 2013 - 23:25, said:

Trent Hari, on 17 May 2013 - 18:38, said:

I also have a JL Audio amp , and I am also having trouble with blowing sub-woofers that should not blow on my amp. ( I blew a Alpine type R and i have a SA-12 that im needing to baby along) Maybe you should look in the JL audio forums and see if JL amps have a bad reputation for being hard on sub-woofers that are not made by JL. ( I wouldn't be surprised) .

You probably should check for amplifier clipping also.

Congratulations on the Xcon by the way smile.png

Seriously? SERIOUSLY?

tumblr_mkc32iJX4V1rjhbn2o1_400.gif

LOL sometimes I REALLY shouldn't type what's on my mind when i'm tired. -

At least i mentioned clipping! wink.png

On another note, i fail to see how saying "Seriously" twice is much more helpful than what i posted.

Seriously, though. I wouldn't be surprised if Member rustydawwg blew his subs in much the same way i did- i wasn't satisfied with the output, so i cranked up the gains until i was, which was probably near clipping, if not actually clipping, the amplifier, or over driving the sub-woofer. Then a song with a lot of bass came along so i turned up the volume - making the problem even worse until the sub couldn't take it any longer, and either overheated,(my Alpine Type S) or bottomed out so hard it broke the voice coil (my Alpine Type R).

Edited by Trent Hari

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I also have a JL Audio amp , and I am also having trouble with blowing sub-woofers that should not blow on my amp. ( I blew a Alpine type R and i have a SA-12 that im needing to baby along) Maybe you should look in the JL audio forums and see if JL amps have a bad reputation for being hard on sub-woofers that are not made by JL. ( I wouldn't be surprised) .

 

You probably should check for amplifier clipping also.

Congratulations on the Xcon by the way :)

Type R's suck man. I had 2 new ones 600w rms each in a ported box with an RE audio 2000w amp (gain past halfway) and they never blew. Switched to a real amp (1000/1) and they popped in 2days with the gain a notch above zero. switched in my rlp18 which played amazingly until a hot day came along (100 degrees) and I think the VC got damaged at that point but the sub was still playing. Tried contacting Mike at SoundSplinter with no luck. With my budget theres no way I was going to give some guy $450 for a used 13w7 thats most likely been abused, so I ended up coming here.

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Type r's are fantastic subs

 

Blame your lack of audio knowledge. 

You keep thinking that - I have the warrenty replacement Alpine type R D4 ohm from the one I blew that i'm selling for $125 Plus shipping, that's never been opened, or used. I sure as hell won't hook one up to my amp again.

Edited by Trent Hari

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I also have a JL Audio amp , and I am also having trouble with blowing sub-woofers that should not blow on my amp. ( I blew a Alpine type R and i have a SA-12 that im needing to baby along) Maybe you should look in the JL audio forums and see if JL amps have a bad reputation for being hard on sub-woofers that are not made by JL. ( I wouldn't be surprised) .

 

You probably should check for amplifier clipping also.

Congratulations on the Xcon by the way smile.png

Type R's suck man. I had 2 new ones 600w rms each in a ported box with an RE audio 2000w amp (gain past halfway) and they never blew. Switched to a real amp (1000/1) and they popped in 2days with the gain a notch above zero. switched in my rlp18 which played amazingly until a hot day came along (100 degrees) and I think the VC got damaged at that point but the sub was still playing. Tried contacting Mike at SoundSplinter with no luck. With my budget theres no way I was going to give some guy $450 for a used 13w7 thats most likely been abused, so I ended up coming here.

I actually got a ton of crap for posting that lol

I think what i meant to say was maybe JL amps actually put out what they say they are rated at  (or more) and those people who are running "1500 watts rms" to their SA-12s are probably full of sh*t or using low-end amps because my amp is raping that thing. Don't worry , that xcon will most likely take a dump on that 13w7 in terms of pure output, and the support here is amazing from my experiences.

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I don't understand why my opinion means I have a lack of knowledge? Ive tried them out and decided they are not for me. Besides they were rated at 600w a piece and didn't last 2 days with 1000/1. Thats with the gain almost at zero with no bass boost. My soundsplinter ( rated at 1000rms) was beaten on a daily basis since last september before it retired a week ago.

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I don't understand why my opinion means I have a lack of knowledge? Ive tried them out and decided they are not for me. Besides they were rated at 600w a piece and didn't last 2 days with 1000/1. Thats with the gain almost at zero with no bass boost. My soundsplinter ( rated at 1000rms) was beaten on a daily basis since last september before it retired a week ago.

Possibly the subwoofer gain on the headunit was turned up? or maybe the subs were wired to the wrong ohm load?

There's so many ways to blow a sub its not funny.

- i wont argue with your opinion though- i happen to agree

The Alpine Type R that I blew was the 5th gen - rated at 1000 rms... i'm not the first person to blow one on rated power, judging by the reviews.

Don't feel bad about not knowing things- i had no idea how much im going to need to learn to be considered even competent around here.

Edited by Trent Hari

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I also have a JL Audio amp , and I am also having trouble with blowing sub-woofers that should not blow on my amp. ( I blew a Alpine type R and i have a SA-12 that im needing to baby along) Maybe you should look in the JL audio forums and see if JL amps have a bad reputation for being hard on sub-woofers that are not made by JL. ( I wouldn't be surprised) .

 

You probably should check for amplifier clipping also.

Congratulations on the Xcon by the way :)

Type R's suck man. I had 2 new ones 600w rms each in a ported box with an RE audio 2000w amp (gain past halfway) and they never blew. Switched to a real amp (1000/1) and they popped in 2days with the gain a notch above zero. switched in my rlp18 which played amazingly until a hot day came along (100 degrees) and I think the VC got damaged at that point but the sub was still playing. Tried contacting Mike at SoundSplinter with no luck. With my budget theres no way I was going to give some guy $450 for a used 13w7 thats most likely been abused, so I ended up coming here.

I actually got a ton of crap for posting that lol

I think what i meant to say was maybe JL amps actually put out what they say they are rated at  (or more) and those people who are running "1500 watts rms" to their SA-12s are probably full of sh*t or using low-end amps because my amp is raping that thing. Don't worry , that xcon will most likely take a dump on that 13w7 in terms of pure output, and the support here is amazing from my experiences.

Idk if it has anything to do with r.i.p.s. but it almost reminds me of the difference of a diesel vs gas engine. The diesel makes more torque and therefore is not phased as much by hillclimbs/towing. Just like the JL creates same power output at 11-14v and 1.5-4ohms at the expense of the electrical system its hooked up to.

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Btw any of you have any input to share on the ultra light mdf material? (the kind used in khaotik enclosures) It would be nice to save some weight, I gained an extra 40 miles to the tank after removing my 18!. Thats 15 dollars a week just about to carry that fat sucker around!

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That same output at different impedance's is due to the type of amplifier you have, I think its called a regulated power supply. 

 One more thing you should know about the sub-woofer brands they sell here (especially the one you bought) is they are generally very durable and some of them can handle more than rated power if set up correctly.  I really would not worry about the Xcon you are getting, unless it is put in an awful setup with clipping at that power level  , It should be fine smile.png

 

 

 

Btw any of you have any input to share on the ultra light mdf material? (the kind used in khaotik enclosures) It would be nice to save some weight, I gained an extra 40 miles to the tank after removing my 18!. Thats 15 dollars a week just about to carry that fat sucker around!

Lol any weight that is saved  will come right back with that beast of a sub  apparently its 57 pounds alone looking at the shipping weight. I don't think it will cost any less to carry it around. but ultra light MDF wouldn't hurt  unless the sub gets so much power your sub blows it apart. - one thing to remember the weight isn't the only thing that hurts fuel economy- the alternator does also. -the louder it is, the more fuel the car will use to make the electricity to power the subwoofer.

Edited by Trent Hari

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I plan on trying to find someone with smd tuner to give me a hand once I finish install. Any other ideas of what might cause clipping? Im running nak cd400 headunit I always try to use store cds or at least 320kbs cdrs. I even wired a pac sun rca filter on AUX jack between for when I use my phone and never turn sound card over 70%. Im glad this one is a beast because it will be awhile before I'm inclined to spend much more money on audio as there's other projects I wish to start next year on my car.

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Read this.                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clipping_(audio)

It means your playing the music to loud or you don't know how to set the gain properly or you are using bass boost etc.

Edited by pmureika

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Your playing the music without proper gain , headunit, bassboost, etc. set properly. 

 

 

 

Edited by pmureika

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You guys are the reason there are power ratings on drivers in the first place.

 

Don't worry; after some time in the game, you'll understand why power rating is a worthless specification.

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You guys are the reason there are power ratings on drivers in the first place.

 

Don't worry; after some time in the game, you'll understand why power rating is a worthless specification.

- I'm beginning to come to that conclusion also.

 

Does having better wiring, without a voltage drop help the amp produce more power before distorting or clipping? -

I saw somewhere that amps don't generally put out their full output in vehicles because of the electrical limitations - is that true?

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It is far more involved than that.  Music is dynamic as is the load on the amp at different frequencies in different conditions.  Rarely is an amp ever producing it's rated or normal power.  This is the reason people crank their gains and bass boost.  The human psyche leads you to believe your 2000 watt amp should be a hell of a lot louder and then you start turning knobs, but even if it's not producing 2000 watts and only 1500, you can't hear that difference anyways, so you're just putting more unnecessary strain on the drivers.

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lol i just had a crazy thought - a "clipping filter" lol - after all these years, why hasn't someone invented an amp that cuts power to safe levels when it detects clipping? - they already have "clipping lights" just a thought

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Clipping lights are useless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Ok well then that makes perfect sense. I own a PA that i use insside my house for HT/music and it does have a clip limiter option that I use. I can directly adjust gain up until amp cuts and at that point you can hear the sub begning to clearly distort at that setting until you back it down (theres a very fine line). But on the other hand this doesnt happen until I turn the amp past 3/4 on the rotary knob, the sub will hit very clean and crisp no problem ( ive never ever blown a speaker inside my house for the past 6 years). And then as soon as I transport same speaker/enclosure into my car, the sub obviously will begin to clip way sooner than compared to PA. No bass boost and I like to try to keep gain low and use headunit setting to adjust from there. I've asked a couple shops around here with help with tuning and they all have left me dissapointed. (turning my headunit to max volume, adjusting gain and settings Incorrectly IMO, I had a shop set the subsonic filter for my 18 at 30 hz XD and every time I watch them it looks like the sub is legitimately going to explode because they always start at max volume and tune down from there). Is this because they are simply overdriving system just so its simply "louder" to the customers ears?

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lol i just had a crazy thought - a "clipping filter" lol - after all these years, why hasn't someone invented an amp that cuts power to safe levels when it detects clipping? - they already have "clipping lights" just a thought

McIntosh's Power Guard circuit does just that.  Was used in several Clarion amps as well back when Clarion owned McIntosh.

 

There may be others.  But that's the first to come to mind. 

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