More power for mids?

[j-roadtatts 1,129]

Looking at your build I thought contact was doubtful also. Only reason it came to mind is I just dealt with an install that the owner was unhappy with the mids ands that was the culprit.

Looks like a more robust mid is in order.

[hdrox88 142]

That's what I was figuring. I spent hours searching to come to the ID setup. Looks like it's time to start over.

[///M5 2,833]

Can't see how the ID stuff was ever referenced as having output. Personally I don't really like the sound either, but that of course is subjective.

[hdrox88 142]

At this point it seems new mids are the next step.

They seemed a bit harsh in the 1khz to 4khz area to me at times. 150hz and lower could have been a little more pronounced, but not too bad really. I'm looking for an overall jump in output by a fair amount. If I have to change tweeters as well, so be it. The zapco is my power source for now. I'd like to keep in the $300-$400 range for mids.

I would also like to stick to stick door location which has about 3.5-4" mount depth with the 3/4" baffle I'm using. 6.5" drivers would be great, though I may be able to squeeze an 8" in there if it would really make a difference. I'm not too sure about making any enclosure in the door at this point so IB capable is kinda big.

Edited June 22, 2014 by hdrox88

[///M5 2,833]

Where are they output challenged?

[hdrox88 142]

Mid bass is the first thing that comes to mind with these particular drivers as far as lacking output. It's there, just not in plentiful amounts if that makes sense. I'm not sure if that's what you are talking about, or where the driver starts falling apart when pushed too far.

[///M5 2,833]

Have you played with compensating with your sub? Including turning up your HP on the mids to see if it extends where they start falling apart? Also curious what part of the frequency range is lacking first causing you to keep indexing the volume.

[hdrox88 142]

I haven't tried compensating with the sub as in the past setting the LP anything above 80hz just sounded off. As I increase volume, the first place I notice the sound break up is in the lower vocal range. Most times strong mid bass will fall apart at the same volume level.

[///M5 2,833]

Same thing occur with the HP turned up?

[hdrox88 142]

I've tried it with the HP at 100hz and it seemed to help a bit, though I didn't spend much time like that as I didn't like how it sounded.

[///M5 2,833]

Where do you have it set normally? What about it didn't you like?

Random offerings of speakers are NOT going to help. We really need to know exactly where these go South for you and why so we can lead you in the right direction.

If the 100Hz you don't like as much but gives you the output you need it'll change recommendations significantly.

[hdrox88 142]

I understand, I am open to any questions. Getting the wrong speakers is definitely not something I want to do. I normally set the HP at 80hz with a 24db slope. I had it at 100hz with a 12db slope. It didn't sound terrible, I just wasn't crazy about what sound was lost.

[///M5 2,833]

I understand, I am open to any questions. Getting the wrong speakers is definitely not something I want to do. I normally set the HP at 80hz with a 24db slope. I had it at 100hz with a 12db slope. It didn't sound terrible, I just wasn't crazy about what sound was lost.

You need to redo that test, placebo bit you in the ass.

While you do that, really spend some time critically listening. At this point you have some setup woes and until those are resolved it is going to be extremely hard to recommend something that will help.

[hdrox88 142]

Will do, I should have some time after work today.

[///M5 2,833]

As always it helps to listen altogether and then just to ONE driver at a time. If you haven't done that for your tuning yet...you need to.

[hdrox88 142]

Actually, I have not. This is my first active setup so the learning curve is steep right now.

[///M5 2,833]

I realize. Exactly why playing WAY more before shopping will only help.

Really try to describe everything that bugs you. It WILL help

[hdrox88 142]

Well, I got to play for about an hour today when my fuel pump died(99% sure). I can't for the life of me remember when I did it, but my HP for the mids was at 100hz @ 18db when I started tweaking today, go figure. When the sub is on, I can't tell the difference between setting the mid HP to 80hz or 100hz. With the sub off, however, I can tell when I change it. 100hz at 12db seems to give a nice roll-off without getting out of control. I played with tuning left and right sides separately and noticed that the right side seems much more full than the left side. I got them sounding as close as I could and then played them together. It does seem to sound a little better, which is great. It just seems I have hit a brick wall in the output department with this equipment and install location.

 

They sound pretty good, though I don't have a lot to compare to at this point. If I were to be looking for things to complain about with these drivers, this would be it. They could use a little help in the midbass(<125hz) area. At times, on different tracks the higher range(~2khz-3khz or so) of these mids seem to get a little harsh/peak and I find myself dialing them back a few db in this area to tame them. This next part I am pretty sure has to do with taking time with the eq, but some tracks sound kinda flattened out or almost like an old phonograph. That is a bit of an exaggeration, but there is a hint of that kind of sound to it. Or maybe it's just a bad quality track here and there.

 

That's about it for now until I can get her running again.

[///M5 2,833]

Is it only the midbass where they run out of steam?

[hdrox88 142]

For the most part. They aren't terrible, though I occasionally find myself wanting to boost 125hz and 80hz a bit. I try to match the output of the sub to the front stage the best I can, but it seems like there is a lull in the 100hz-70hz area. The mid range on these things is great! At least in my narrow opinion. Vocals and guitars are very pronounced.

[///M5 2,833]

Ignore the midbass for a while, ie turn the mids up to 120Hz at 24db and then listen to them. See where they fatigue/create problems.

[hdrox88 142]

Sounds good. Now I just need to get my truck running so I don't kill my batteries and roast myself in the process. 130 degrees inside the cab is not fun.

[j-roadtatts 1,129]

  This next part I am pretty sure has to do with taking time with the eq, but some tracks sound kinda flattened out or almost like an old phonograph. That is a bit of an exaggeration, but there is a hint of that kind of sound to it. Or maybe it's just a bad quality track here and there.

 

Where are you getting your signal source from while testing? MP3, CD, satellite, ipad?  I personally have the best luck with CD's I am very familiar with, as this leaves the least amount of unknown factors. 

[///M5 2,833]

...or EXTREMELY well ripped digital audio.

Great point though J, things will fall on their face FAST with a shitty recording. Something you never notice of course with crappy speakers.

[hdrox88 142]

I use an iPad mini, connected via the USB on the 80prs. From what I have read, the digital signal gets converted by the hu that way, not the ipad. Majority of my music is iTunes purchased, though some tracks are mp3 from who knows where. CDs drive me crazy as I would be constantly swapping them out if I listened in the same way I do with the ipad.