NDMstang65

I'm not saying me Neil, i'm not looking in my view point, i'm looking at the end users view point, or the one that actually matters. I might like fish and chips, but if nobody else in the world likes fish and chips then why should i try to market it or prove to you that fish and chips are fantastic and you should try them? I did mention that it will sound different with different head units, and different cars...this is simulating the scenario that it is actually going to go in...Nobody runs the same stuff amigo . Your looking way far into everything, keep it simple man. You can build the coolest car with superior handling to anything on the market...v10, blower, heated seats, heated coffee cup, a/c coffee cup..the PERFECT car. Right? But some jackass hillbilly buys the car and sinks it in a mud hole with a bunch of his toothless buddies...now that's not the perfect car, now is it? But all the data indicated it is the perfect car for everybody. Right? Paper is paper amigo, you have to entertain the audience in which you are selling to and is putting food on your table, not your comrades who get their jollies off to numbers and graphical data.

Build an anechoic chamber, make a driver play completely flat in there, should sound 'perfect' correct? Because 'flat' response is what we are going for in a SQ car right? Slap it in a car and play The Eagles - When hell freezes over album...tell me what you hear. Is it enjoyable? Or is it dead and lifeless? EVERYTHING behaves differently, that's why i am saying there is no real point in doing all of that technical graphical and yadda yadda data gathering, the only basis that you have when it is all said and done is yeah these numbers are different then these numbers in this anechoic chamber according to this computer data analysis...and should THEORETICALLY sound better (theory, not real world, not law, not proven...simply cant be because you have 10 million different variables ranging from the different car(s) that the driver is going in, to the head units, amps, cd quality, mp3 quality, wire quality...the acoustical mass of air on the given day...etc etc etc..) You simply can not definitively say that brand X is going to sound better then brand Y because all of the numbers indicate so...what if brand X has a pulp cone and brand Y has a plastic cone, and brand Y plays flatter and models way better then brand X, but when put into the scenario in which it is designed for...it sounds like shit has no bottom end, flops around like a fish out of water and breaks up, and the pulp coned woofer contrary to the numbers and graphical data plays marvelously up to 90Hz? The only way you can definitively say that is if we all road around in that exact same anechoic chamber that you have built and based all of your testing off of...other then that, you'll never see the same results or response, not to mention everybody's ears are different...in short yes it would be a basis to go off of...but at the end of the day is it really going to matter that said driver sounds like 'crap' according to the graphical data, but in turn it is what i like to listen to and i thoroughly enjoy it?...don't take it to heart...you can argue those very numbers that you have worked so very hard on until you are blue in the face, if the end user doesn't hear what he/she likes to hear, they are not going to give 3 shits what your data says regardless . We listen with the ears, not with the eyes gentleman, don't forget that.

Like i said all of the theory is great, as is the technical data... We created a real world scenario with the 12 challenge and so many people called bullshit that it's honestly turned me bitter towards the subject. It's just entirely too hard to do what needs to be done to the T to definitively say this is what this is, end of story...myth busted . I'll just live for the music...because thats what it's all about

Just an example Neil. Why do you think so many people buy XBL^2 based drivers and sell them because they don't get 'loud' or sound 'lifeless'? Many many many many people do not like a flat response curve type woofer/driver...live music has peaks and valley's in it, it's easy to make a speaker to play flat and have all the great numbers, but when it really gets down to it and you finally listen to music on it...it quite frankly sounds horrid.. Numbers are great, i love talking numbers and technology... At the end of the day you have to step back and examine how much of this theory, numbers, etc relates to a real world musical experience...it does relate to an extent, but there is a lot of it that is merely a waste of time..unless everybody who were to buy speakers and audio and enjoy music knew everything and all theories that went behind it... It's the simple fact that the end consumer for the most part knows nothing of anything that you speak of. You say its going to sound better because it has less distortion...they don't know what that is, so how are they going to relate?

Turn you subsonic up to 3-4Hz below tuning...that will get rid of the popping, you are going to kill the subs if you dont...you are unloading them Thanks! -Nick

I saw the big 12 challenge but apparently I missed what I was looking for. I'll take another look. You did the testing I'm speaking of? What i think you are looking for is something that really does not matter, with the 12 challenge we reproduced a daily driving type scenario..with generalized boxes, and generalized installs with response curves of this woofer does this given scenario A, B, and C. At the end of the day a speaker is to reproduce music, all the numbers and hooplah matters none... Beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. Beauty IS in the eye of the beholder but the numbers DO matter. How else can we give someone any idea of how something might sound via text? Sure some people like high distortion, but the numbers will show them which speakers to go for if they want that I guess we agree to disagree. You can argue numbers until your blue in the face. At the end of the day it's all personal taste. If subject A thinks that 2% THD sounds better to him/her then that is the end of the arguement. You can argue that subwoofer from company X will sound leaps and bounds better because your graphical data indicated less that .000000001% THD through the full sound spectrum... He'll buy the sub, say your an idiot, and we're back to square one.

I saw the big 12 challenge but apparently I missed what I was looking for. I'll take another look. You did the testing I'm speaking of? What i think you are looking for is something that really does not matter, with the 12 challenge we reproduced a daily driving type scenario..with generalized boxes, and generalized installs with response curves of this woofer does this given scenario A, B, and C. At the end of the day a speaker is to reproduce music, all the numbers and hooplah matters none... Beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.

What final impedance are you looking for is what i'm asking ? Thanks! -Nick

No graphical pc type program will do what we did with the great 12 challenge.. Where only 1 variable was changed at each interval Welcome to the forum...

That a brahma with a flat back plate... Yeah we can recone it for you..what coils are you looking for?

What kind of power are you going to be working with?

No flat copper coil..i think scott has a 4 layer round wire copper coil, but your looking at around 800-900w rms with that one..

"IM GOOD...IM GOOD" hahahahaha hbd focker.

Snap some pics of it...dont have a clue what it is Thanks! -Nick

Snap a few pics..if it's a standard 3.000" coil then yes...ball park figure is 100-110ish Thanks! -Nick

Don't have any way of getting ahold of Scott, i talked to Pol..hopefully he'll beable to get ahold of him for you and get you an answer tonight..

Is the 1.9 cubes after all displacements? Thanks! -Nick

What kind of vehicle is it going in? If it's an SUV you may be better off doing something along the lines of a pair of 18" Q's...but it's really dependant how much actual space (some dimensions to work with would be great) you have to work with...otherwise a pair of 15's would work nicely... Thanks! -Nick

Good good :D

Hey Am! How's everything across the pond? -Nick

Drift? Whaddya mean..drift?! skeeeeeeeeeeeerrrr

you knows what that is ramos :D oh schnapz.

no chat? gaaaaaaay very gaaaaaaaaaay i'll just do this

ramos...chat!