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With companies like RF you are paying for a custom engineered product from a corporation with employees and facilities to maintain, from engineers to customer service, and the need for internal R&D expenses (etc) primarily sold through a dealer network that also has employees and facilities to maintain and a product sold only to one market; the consumer (ignoring the OEM side of some companies like RF). With internet amplifier companies like Sundown you are receiving a product that was selected from a buildhouse, some part changes made and a different label stuck on the heatsink. The buildhouse sells units business to business, anywhere from a couple to dozens of companies and the internet company reselling the product doesn't have nearly the overhead as it's usually the owner and maybe one or two employees who likely have no benefits that need paid for (etc). That's not an overly detailed description, but it's easy to see why internet companies can sell an amplifier for a third of the price of an amplifier with comparable power in a retail store, and why the amplifiers in the retail store aren't "a ripoff"...they're selling for what they need to make a profit and stay in business.

Looking Good...I too have a Taurus and I know for a fact you can get a 6 cube box in the trunk with no issues. I have a BL on 2.8 K and you should be very happy with your new set up

I see this type of reply from ALOT of new people on this forum. I think M5 simply tells people how it is with no fluff and it's usually not what they want to hear and they think he's being an ass about it. Plus I'm sure he gets tired of the newbs who post the ridiculous "Think this will go boom like so?" posts and questions that could be answered with a simple search too and I can see where he can get a little edgey about it sometimes. Besides where did he ever refer to you as a douche? Not in this thread anyway, so why dump in the OP's thread about it? Now, to the OP, If you already own Fi then I wouldn't think about changing anything if I was you. However, if you've bought the amp and are looking for subs to go along with it, purchase the ones that meet the goals the best for the sound you're looking for and the budget you have to spend on them. DC makes some fantastic subwoofers, there's countless threads on both brands about the build quality, sound, and SPL from their subs. You really can't go wrong with either as long as you're buying it to fit the purpose and goal.

Huh? Grow up. Earned yourself your last warning and a bit of vacation. Not quite sure how you went from my post to me being a douche other than the fact that you obviously hate me and everything I type. Stop taking things personally and move on forward otherwise you won't have the choice.

i dont understand why you ask for thelp, then call everyone out like they dont know their shit. im not saying i do, but someone in your position should not be calling out ppl who are trying to help you. they are making bad comments about you bc you call them out. if you are not gonna take advice, then fine, dont. but keep it to yourself, do your thing and let it be at that. theres no need to call everyone out man, its ridiculous.

Exactly. Without details of the motor, it's impossible to know how well the recone will work. And it's basket, not gasket. I thought it was a typo but you've used it in both posts now. No idea, we have no details of the motor. I would guess you probably don't even know the diameter of the coil. But beyond that, you don't have enough information about the motor to even begin to determine if the resulting subwoofer will be decent or crap. Nevermind my above posts, this statement settles it. YOU HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO BUSINESS TRYING TO CUSTOM BUILD A SUBWOOFER. That simple. Don't do it. You don't know enough yet. It's not your fault, and I'm not calling you stupid or dumb as a person. But it would be a horribly stupid and dumb idea for you to build a custom subwoofer with the complete lack of knowledge you currently possess. Thiele Small Parameters

A good place to start; The Subwoofer DIY Page - 4th Order Bandpass Systems It has links to calculations in the side bar. General rule of thumb; the more efficient within the passband, the narrower the passband will be. So if you want to increase efficiency of the design, you're going to reduce the bandwidth. The size of each enclosure and tuning frequency will determine the bandwidth (and other aspects) of the enclosure. They are chosen based on design goals. Make sure you get T/S parameters for the sub you have having built. Without them an enclosure will be impossible to design.

You don't need to build subwoofers for a living to understand that they recommend you tune high because the driver's Fs is ri-pucking-diculously high. I have some 7" mids here that have an Fs only 2hz higher than the Fs of the 12" HDC3. You're 7" mids are midbass drivers. (and a Fs of 43hz on a 12" inch driver isn't super high, and the 10 inch has a Fs of 41hz.) And remember the T/S specs aren't averaged between a few woofers, they took 1 woofer and took the T/S parameters without a break-in period.(Break in period lowers Fs quite a bit in a few cases.) No, an Fs of 43hz for a 12" driver is ridiculously high, and the reason the driver needs to be in a high tuned enclosure.

shizzle!

Any hard surface acts as a "mirror" for sound waves. Luckily for us, the wavelengths of the of subbass soundwaves are significantly longer than the dimension of the enclosure....so these reflections aren't a problem.

If you want to fiberglass something do the corners.

Again, you have to learn financial responsibility at some point. Drill into your head that you can't use the credit card without knowing exactly from where and when the money to pay it off will come from, and you'll be fine. In fact it's advisable to get a credit card at some point early on in life and buy little things with it and pay it off right away, just so that you can begin building credit. Your credit score can be your best friend or your worst enemy. Become determined to be responsible with a credit card and it can be very useful tool.

Again, not audible...but the box will be weaker. Others may come on and say differently, but I guarantee they are doing so out of propaganda and haven't tested it...and in general will have a rather limited idea of materials and material testing. Always an amusing conversation to me, but nonetheless if its already done then so be it, don't worry about it, but if your goals aren't competing to the nth degree don't bother to do it again.

The opposite, peakier sound. Either way, it won't be audible to your ears. Measurable perhaps, but no audible. Completely the wrong idea unless you are chasing tenths on a meter and then only perhaps helpful, could be the opposite.

Won't be smoother, won't be warmer, just perhaps louder. Either way it won't be an audible difference.

If you want to build things Heavy Duty then fiberglass isn't the solution, but bracing is. Look up the matrix bracing on B&W's speakers and see how it should be done if you are truly into overboard mode. Resin will weaken mdf, not strengthen it. It will help you get louder perhaps, but regularly an unbraced floppy box is louder than a well built one from an SPL perspective.

10ths on a meter, nothing really audible. It won't help with much of the above and if by fiberglass you mean resin alone it will actually make the mdf weaker. If you mean glass, well then you should reinforce it as glass isn't particularly great in flat areas. Doing that though will knock the 10ths off from above. If you aren't competing or aren't worth building a few different boxes to play around I wouldn't bother.

fiberglass acts as a mirror for sound waves

i have read multiple opinions about the glass on the inside of the box, regarding to how it might affect the sound. do you have any words of wisdom on it? in short i see spl guys likeing it more than sq, saying that to mention, obviously, you are after sq. the creative approach on the port, the glass work, the goals in mind, and fab work on the trunk leads one to believe this is going to be a sweet build log to the end. what deadening will you be doing again and how much of it? looking good, chop

Damn, some people never learn. . . .

aq recommends the following on average- 1.5cuft per 10 2.0-2.5cuft per 12 4.0cuft per 15 6.0cuft per 18 All tuned around 38hz. I've given my opinion about them in the review section. These subs can take massive amounts of power and people who like that really are not looking for the best of sounds because the typical sound pressure levels many are aiming towards these days are the high 140s and when getting that high, your ears have a hard time distinguishing difference in install comparison and just perceive it as loud and louder...

I didn't ask for his opinion, I asked for information regarding the specs of the box and the frequency it was tuned at. I did not get that question answered, I would like to know this to get a better idea of what exactly left him with his opinion. Because just saying its a "fart box" isn't getting me no where. I would like to know the size of the woofer, and the specs of the box.. just saying it was the AQ specs isn't telling me nothing much... like how many cubes exactly. Then you said the box, the word box is not plural, so if you making your opinion off one box in one install, I think maybe you should try listening to one in a different box or another install.

Forum boner is a rather common term, I am sorry that it frustrates you so much. As for the box, followed the lovely AQ specs...which are absurd, but of course they have to be considering the T/S of the sub.

Hate to say it, but he comes of as a dick... that's what I've picked up from his post. He made this site seem very unwelcoming to me, making it as a whole look bad. I would like to hear about his particular experiences with subwoofer, what has he heard specifically that has been so bad about it. I would also like to know the specs of the box and the frequency that left you with such a a horrible opinion on the subwoofer.

I have ears. Not sure where yours are. You are a quite helpful person but you are also the most miserable person here aswell. Jeez....Maybe if you spent as much time trying to get some (which Id bet its been years) as you do degrading people.... Oh btw, tampons are on sale at walmart.

well Im sorry you are mad that I cut that tab out, but I the time for that install we had to. I have alot more pics if you want me to post them.

I'd suggest brand boning something different. No reason to run a WMD.

Its a fart cannon. Not musical at all. As for the other comments. I don't bad mouth people, I do come off aggressively on comments though. But that is too fucking bad, perhaps if the comments actually were worth a shit in the first place I wouldn't. What I hate is what all the noob idiots are doing to the forum. It used to have a lot of well spoken questions and they all get answered well. Instead now we have a bunch of shit questions that NO ONE should try to answer because all they are doing is confusing the issue. Unlike the others who want to self promote and push what they have, I truly just want to help people solve their current dilemma and come up with a solution. All that it takes to get a good answer to this is a few extra seconds of proof reading before you post and making sure it meets the requirements that you agreed to when signing up on the forum. As for the "public forum", no its not. It is privately owned and run. You join here and make a promise to contribute and then you should follow your promise. I get really sick of all you asshats that don't try at all and then get all frustrated when someone doesn't support your post. Grow up, grow some balls, and do what you promised and you wouldn't feel that way.

Just a HAIR less than the NS v.1 -- you can assume it is the same for most purposes.

To each his or her own. The purpose of the topic wasn't in no way to bash people; yet some chose to do so. I am curiosly looking for a cross section of the car audio enthusiast. As an an engineer I like to quantify. And also being a Sociologist I like looking at social demographics. Why is it only SQ folks act like Nazi's?

Picking solely on xmax, would be a stupid decision... but I do love me some excursion, and I look at it as a plus.I look at my warn status, and you talk about me being a douche and you don't like my attitude, when you come off with an attitude on countless post... you told me to post nice or not post at all... shit you never come off as "nice" and from the looks of things you are the one that comes off as a "douche".

You don't need to build subwoofers for a living to understand that they recommend you tune high because the driver's Fs is ri-pucking-diculously high. I have some 7" mids here that have an Fs only 2hz higher than the Fs of the 12" HDC3. You're 7" mids are midbass drivers. (and a Fs of 43hz on a 12" inch driver isn't super high, and the 10 inch has a Fs of 41hz.) And remember the T/S specs aren't averaged between a few woofers, they took 1 woofer and took the T/S parameters without a break-in period.(Break in period lowers Fs quite a bit in a few cases.) AQ drivers are designed to work the best with higher tuned boxes which don't need as much space. Because they are tuned higher then normal they need to have a suspension that is harder and not a soft suspension. That how they get a high Fs, low moving mass and strong suspension that controls the cone if it goes below tuning. You can tune a woofer below Fs without a lot of problems, but if you don't stick with optimal enclosure volume and tuning they are going to sound like shit. Because the manufacture gives quite a lot of optoins you can build it how you like it. BTW, they have a SQ competitor: Competitor Highlight – Sound Quality Competitor LewisBrood Name: Lewis Brood, Competitor 2005 Kia Sorento lx SUBs: AQHDC312 x 2 woofers- 2-aq hdc3 ,12 inch duel 2ohm wiring by – tsunami and knukonceptz 2007 team northeast competitor of the year 2007 team northeast 3rd place woofercooker 2 2007 iasca Finals, stock 2 champ 2007 iasca Finals, 3rd place rookie- sound quality 2008 team northeast 3rd place woofercooker 1 pro 151 db is my best record so far to date with a lot more to come !!!!!! Lewis has never placed less than 3rd in over 20 sound quality competitions!

ITS ON A PUBLIC FORUM THAT HAS THOUSANDS OF MEMBERS LOLOLOL I think I reserve the right to comment!