edouble101

I am anxious to get ta dialed in a go from there. Enjoy your vacation.

Thanks I will check that out.

Yeah you know exactly what song I was thinking about!!! Sounds great in my car other than exaggerated simblance. I already have a dash mat. What would towels do?

If I do change my apillars I would like to use a tweeter that has less sibilance (pronounced "s" sound in female voices) than the LGP's that I have now. Using the LGP's on-axis may make sibilance worse, idk. I like the small format (physical size) of the LGP's. The Morel 4" mids I have probably have less distortion than the JL's I am using now. Unfortunately I haven't been able to find Klippel graphs for the Morel's.Good luck to you too!

The above graphs are all 6 averages taken around the driver's side head rest with 1/3 smoothing.

I lied about not taking any measurements. I did take a few fr readings. I should have said that I did not take any impulse, t/a or decay measurements. Here is the midbass and midrange graphs together. Blue line left midrange, red line right midrange. Purple is left midbass, green is right midbass. Midrange are crossed at 100-8k and misbass are crossed at 20-2k. Noise floor is high due to the fan on my KS900.6. It will not be as high next time. It looks as though I could cross the midrange lower although I do not know the distortion plot yet. Crossed at 160hz@18db and playing a 150hz test tone at near max volume creates a nasty panel resonance in the a-pillar. I might need to treat that. Full system plot (again high noise floor) with individual paired drivers plots. Same xover as before only midbass low pass at 160hz@24 db and midrange high pass at 160@18db.

Do you compete MECA ?? If so and if you don't mind me asking ... What class do you compete in ??I'm assuming that you would be in Modified Class. If you do redo you A-pillars to more of an on-axis style, you know that you will be moving up in classes to MODDEX or Extreme ... depending on the A-pillars. I will be placed in Modex. It doesnt matter to me what class I am in. There are so few shows in the tri-state are that competing will probably never be anything too serious.

Ehh equipment issues I didn't foresee. My desktop crapped out and my laptop doesn't have the necessary hardware. I did not take any PC measurements yesterday or today. I have a Tascam US-122MKII on order and measurements will begin once I get it.

The difference is installation.

I am planning on using the PC to set T/A this Holiday weekend. I am willing to redo the pillars. What do you suggest? I have not eq'd up under 300hz with only the 4" playing. I never considered that since that isnt how I would permanently use them. I will give it a try.

After reading the DIYMA thread I referenced the cross-talk and glass reflections are drastically reducing my stage width. I am against kick panel mounting mids and tweets I think I will always have midbass mounted in the kicks. Just makes sense. I plan on attempting under dash midbass at some point though but not in this vehicle. And I do not like the "rainbow" soundstage with kick mounted M/T.

Sound stage width. Width referring to the "width" of the perceived soundstage. Why wouldnt I (or anybody that has SQ as a goal) want a wide soundstage? As of now it is set by ear. I have tried using strictly distance measurements. This resulted in a center image above the steering wheel, left image crushed next to the center (due to having no width) and a large gap between center and right image. Tuning by ear resulted in a good center under the rear view mirror, left image and right image equal distance from center. I have reason to believe that PC measurement may help in dialing this in and widen the stage somewhat. I have not adjusted T/A by PC but will be soon. Center, for now is the center of the car. If I could expand the left image outside the car by increasing stage width then center would be at the steering wheel. It is there for now because that is where it sounds best. Currently my mids were (1) positioned for fitment in the pillar. (2) They are each aimed at the opposite apillar top corner to. This way neither midrange is either 100% on or off-axis. Not the best method by any means, probably more-so haphazard than anything else. I will need an explanation before I can answer. I think that using a 4" midrange crossed lower than 250hz mounted high and wide would help stage width and dynamics. I also think that if I find a full range or tweeter to mount beside the 4" midrange to high pass 800-1khz that tonally and imaging would be best. The 8" midbass that are in the kicks would be mostly used to help blend the subbass into the front stage playing a narrow band of frequencies. Ah hah. No measurements were taken, well not yet. On my bucket list of things to do is to PC measure the response of the individual drivers FR and choose xover points at the 6db down point. Current xover points are chosen based on manufacturer specs and tuning. Tuning-> adjust xover->listen and repeat many many times until the soundstage imaged best. I had overlapping xover points at one point. I think I made my goal clear, to increase stage width. Which ultimately concludes to a better sounding soundstage. Good read from some very knowledgeable folks involved in the industry. This particular thread is a couple years old. Every forum has bs intertwined within useful information. Depends on the reader to decipher the truth.

BTW I am currently reading this thread which i should have read first!!

I have numerous t/a arrangements. The end result is a shift in the center image which is either far left, center, far right. T/A has helped depth or creates a tunnel affect. If T/A is way off nasty phase issues arise.

Hey man thanks for offering help

Quoted you this time Tweets high pass 4k@18db Mids high pass 250@24db, low pass 4k@18db Midbass high pass 80hz@12db, low pass 250@24db Subs high pass 40hz@18db (very bloated bottom end a high pass at this freq to help flatten the response under 40hz) low pass 80@24db

Again, smearing is an issue but widening the soundstage is more important to me at this point. Although in a rebuild I do not want to have smearing

I am not having issues +4khz. It is the lower midrange that is smearing (which again isnt THAT bad). I do like tweets up high to help in stage height ques.

Tweets high pass 4k@18db Mids high pass 250@24db, low pass 4k@18db Midbass high pass 80hz@12db, low pass 250@24db Subs high pass 40hz@18db (very bloated bottom end a high pass at this freq to help flatten the response under 40hz) low pass 80@24db

That its how my tweets are now. The top end slightly suffers from their off-axis performance.

HU: Pioneer P99RS Amp for front stage: Arc Audio KS900.6 Tweets: LGP 25NFA Mids: JL Audio 4" Midbass: JL Audio 8" Amp for sub: Sundown SAZ-1500D v.3 Sub: (2) Fi Audio IB315 I think I have my front stage dialed in pretty good. My tuning includes, gain level setting, t/a, phase adjustment, rta (not relied on heavily), eq balance adjustments and crossover setting. Not in that order but those are some adjustments I made. I also meet with a MECA multi champion who was very helpful in the tuning process. The two biggest issues my setup has right now is slight smearing to the right side and I would really like the soundstage to be wider. The smearing of the center image is very sight but is noticeable if you listen to my system long enough and know what to listen for. I believe this is due to the off-axis driver's side midrange and on-axis passenger side midrange. Not anything tuning can fix. But the smearing is so very slight that only a judge or a trained ear would notice it. What is more important to me to fix is the width of the soundstage. Height and depth are very good. Height is just under the rear view mirror and depth is just outside the windshield. The stage width on the right is at the passenger side mirror and stage width on the left stops dead at the pillar. I am considering redoing my a-pillars. If I would I want to change the midrange to a Morel Hybrid Ovaiton 4W (I have these). I will make sealed pods for the 4W that will enable me to high pass these driver low. In the current configuration I am high passing the JL 4" at 250hz. I would be able to high pass the 4W's lower. I would like to change my tweeter to one that I can high pass lower as well. I would like to keep as much midrange duty in that driver. If I could find a tweet that I could cross under 1khz that would be great. I am thinking about using a Bohlender Graebener Neo-8 PDR. Mounting for the Neo-8 PDR would be in the a-pillar, eye level. Mounting for the 4W would be as wide as possible. I am considering on-axis sail panel mounting the 4W's. That would be as wide as I could get them. Here is a pic of the left side from the driver's seat. Right side from driver's seat. 4W held in the sail panel. What do you guys think of my thoughts on widening my soundstage?

If the Sundown amplifier is at fault then why aren't we hearing of other installations with this amplifier causing subwoofers to catch fire? I think there are a lot more Sundown SAZ-3000 amplifiers being used on the marker than this particular subwoofer.

You could rivet in a piece of metal to cover the hole on your rear deck. The spray some expanding foam around it to help keep it from rattling. Did you look into air shocks for the rear? Could be a cheap temporary fix.

There is a thread on caco from twistedchild420 iirc of him testing these Lanzars. Again, iirc, they took a lot of power and hit over 150's. I donte think these subs get enough credit. Back in the 90's I had two DC series 15's. I loved those subs.

That sub has been around for a few years now.