You are testing me for referances. I have none. You wall have to believe I wouldn't lie to make a point.

I'll search for it though. I know that it was mentioned in a study related to the Body for Life books. As in someone who tried it out and expanded on that body of knowledge.

The only thing I know you can google search and find right away is the huge relation to eating fatty fish and GREAT lpA levels.

I great example of poly/mono fat eaters with great life results are argentinians and eskimo. With some of the richest diets in fat or salt they have the least heart issues. Japan has the next best. Also fish. It's the denatured fats like margarine that will kill you.

Also why use that when butter or lard are so much better!

They also don't eat many carbs, I believe.

Eskimo do not I don't think. But Japan lives on noodles rice and sodium.

Argentine has a weird food profile. But they eat more fish than any culture I think.

Again My body of work is all just my notes.

They also drink a lot so that could modify it somewhat.

Here is something interesting in a one man body of work. I went in with an insane lipid profile after a fast. So bad my doc was ready to have me on meds that day. BP too.

After 4 weeks of a high fat diet that had tons of poly/mono unsaturated the LDL and HDL flipped. I was still high, but when you are loosing weight it is to be expected.

I had ~6 tablespoons of Udo's oil. It's about the only product I will endorse by name to supplement users. I actually believe that a huge majority of people "dieting" don't get enough fat and that will sure help.

I wasn't questioning you, I simply would have liked to read it is all.

I love me some fish!

I am only one person and have a lot of weird quirks. I was hospitalizable high BP once on just a regular visit.... 2 weeks later I had it down 20 points or so.

Here is something kinda cool. Generalized though, and not a lot of numbers.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/fats-full-story/

Here is something interesting in a one man body of work. I went in with an insane lipid profile after a fast. So bad my doc was ready to have me on meds that day. BP too.

After 4 weeks of a high fat diet that had tons of poly/mono unsaturated the LDL and HDL flipped. I was still high, but when you are loosing weight it is to be expected.

I had ~6 tablespoons of Udo's oil. It's about the only product I will endorse by name to supplement users. I actually believe that a huge majority of people "dieting" don't get enough fat and that will sure help.

I've read that somewhere. I know there is a ratio that should be used for taking omega-3 & omega-6, and Udo makes use of it.

Ha!

He notated it for me!!!

Dutch researchers conducted an analysis of 60 trials that examined the effects of carbohydrates and various fats on blood lipid levels. In trials in which polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats were eaten in place of carbohydrates, these good fats decreased levels of harmful LDL and increased protective HDL. (

19) More recently, a randomized trial known as the Optimal Macronutrient Intake Trial for Heart Health (OmniHeart) showed that replacing a carbohydrate-rich diet with one rich in unsaturated fat, predominantly monounsaturated fats, lowers blood pressure, improves lipid levels, and reduces the estimated cardiovascular risk. (7)

Most people don't get enough of these healthful unsaturated fats each day. No strict guidelines have been published regarding their intake. The traditional Greek diet, for example, gets up to 30 percent of its calories from monounsaturated fats, mostly from olive oil. For polyunsaturated fats, the American Heart Association has set 8 to 10 percent of calories as a prudent target; there is evidence, though, that eating more polyunsaturated fat—on the order of 15 percent of daily calories—in place of saturated fat can lower heart disease risk. (

13) Since no one eats by percentage of daily calories, a good rule of thumb is to choose foods rich in unsaturated fats over foods rich in saturated fats whenever possible. (To learn more, check out this chart, Finding Foods with Healthy Fats.)

So due to a stomach bug, I was forced to adopt a fasting type diet Stephan. I have not lost much weight from my overall 70 lbs, but today at costco I tried to tighten my belt, and I could not as there were no more holes.....

I couldn't put that belt over my gut in Dec/Jan. Roughly 10" change.

Scanned through some of the article, they kinda go back and forth between some view points, but still presents some good information.

Ha!

He notated it for me!!!

Dutch researchers conducted an analysis of 60 trials that examined the effects of carbohydrates and various fats on blood lipid levels. In trials in which polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats were eaten in place of carbohydrates, these good fats decreased levels of harmful LDL and increased protective HDL. (

19) More recently, a randomized trial known as the Optimal Macronutrient Intake Trial for Heart Health (OmniHeart) showed that replacing a carbohydrate-rich diet with one rich in unsaturated fat, predominantly monounsaturated fats, lowers blood pressure, improves lipid levels, and reduces the estimated cardiovascular risk. (7)

Most people don't get enough of these healthful unsaturated fats each day. No strict guidelines have been published regarding their intake. The traditional Greek diet, for example, gets up to 30 percent of its calories from monounsaturated fats, mostly from olive oil. For polyunsaturated fats, the American Heart Association has set 8 to 10 percent of calories as a prudent target; there is evidence, though, that eating more polyunsaturated fat—on the order of 15 percent of daily calories—in place of saturated fat can lower heart disease risk. (

13) Since no one eats by percentage of daily calories, a good rule of thumb is to choose foods rich in unsaturated fats over foods rich in saturated fats whenever possible. (To learn more, check out this chart, Finding Foods with Healthy Fats.)

Only thing with that, they replaced carbs with fat. Which is good, only that's not a comparison between saturated fat and polyunsaturated fat.

So due to a stomach bug, I was forced to adopt a fasting type diet Stephan. I have not lost much weight from my overall 70 lbs, but today at costco I tried to tighten my belt, and I could not as there were no more holes.....

I couldn't put that belt over my gut in Dec/Jan. Roughly 10" change.

Pretty big change.

Only thing I can say is after changing my diet I have way more focus and energy. I've also made some good progress with weights in the last month or so, but that's also to be expected since I'm a beginner.

rain rain don't go away........

Edited April 26, 201213 yr by dem beats

So due to a stomach bug, I was forced to adopt a fasting type diet Stephan. I have not lost much weight from my overall 70 lbs, but today at costco I tried to tighten my belt, and I could not as there were no more holes.....

I couldn't put that belt over my gut in Dec/Jan. Roughly 10" change.

Pretty big change.

Only thing I can say is after changing my diet I have way more focus and energy. I've also made some good progress with weights in the last month or so, but that's also to be expected since I'm a beginner.

The sad part is some people don't progress on certain parts at all for months. Consider yourself fortunate.

J

Ha!

He notated it for me!!!

Dutch researchers conducted an analysis of 60 trials that examined the effects of carbohydrates and various fats on blood lipid levels. In trials in which polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats were eaten in place of carbohydrates, these good fats decreased levels of harmful LDL and increased protective HDL. (

19) More recently, a randomized trial known as the Optimal Macronutrient Intake Trial for Heart Health (OmniHeart) showed that replacing a carbohydrate-rich diet with one rich in unsaturated fat, predominantly monounsaturated fats, lowers blood pressure, improves lipid levels, and reduces the estimated cardiovascular risk. (7)

Most people don't get enough of these healthful unsaturated fats each day. No strict guidelines have been published regarding their intake. The traditional Greek diet, for example, gets up to 30 percent of its calories from monounsaturated fats, mostly from olive oil. For polyunsaturated fats, the American Heart Association has set 8 to 10 percent of calories as a prudent target; there is evidence, though, that eating more polyunsaturated fat—on the order of 15 percent of daily calories—in place of saturated fat can lower heart disease risk. (

13) Since no one eats by percentage of daily calories, a good rule of thumb is to choose foods rich in unsaturated fats over foods rich in saturated fats whenever possible. (To learn more, check out this chart, Finding Foods with Healthy Fats.)

Only thing with that, they replaced carbs with fat. Which is good, only that's not a comparison between saturated fat and polyunsaturated fat.

If you read further they cover tests where they compare sat fat also. It shows there is no evidense that sat fat makes much of a difference. However they have some study material that shows just how bad "transfat" is. I try not to use the word transfat because not all true transfats have to be labeled on nutrition cards. Any trigliceride that is altered will most likely be a bad for you fat. Linked to inflamation, cancer, diabetes, trouble loosing weight etc etc etc.

My take is this, then. Cut out the bad shit. AKA transfat or hydrogenatedblablablah(circa Sean). Any fat heated past its smoking point is ruined health wise. Just don't use it. Lard/butter are more neutral if anything at all. But they are calorie dense. So if you want to look at general health eat foods high in mono/poly unsaturated fats. And that is not canola oil. Olive oil is probably the king there. If you are going to fry, use animal fat with a high smoking point.

So due to a stomach bug, I was forced to adopt a fasting type diet Stephan. I have not lost much weight from my overall 70 lbs, but today at costco I tried to tighten my belt, and I could not as there were no more holes.....

I couldn't put that belt over my gut in Dec/Jan. Roughly 10" change.

Pretty big change.

Only thing I can say is after changing my diet I have way more focus and energy. I've also made some good progress with weights in the last month or so, but that's also to be expected since I'm a beginner.

The sad part is some people don't progress on certain parts at all for months. Consider yourself fortunate.

J

I've been able to up my weighted chins by 5lbs each session (every other day) which is huge. I'm currently at 40lbs for 4 reps. Doing reverse pyramid training.

Just started deadlift yesterday so we'll see how that goes over the following months.

So due to a stomach bug, I was forced to adopt a fasting type diet Stephan. I have not lost much weight from my overall 70 lbs, but today at costco I tried to tighten my belt, and I could not as there were no more holes.....

I couldn't put that belt over my gut in Dec/Jan. Roughly 10" change.

Pretty big change.

Only thing I can say is after changing my diet I have way more focus and energy. I've also made some good progress with weights in the last month or so, but that's also to be expected since I'm a beginner.

The sad part is some people don't progress on certain parts at all for months. Consider yourself fortunate.

J

That is me J. I will diet and scrimp for minimal change and then SHAZAM it all changes overnight. I'll hold water and not loose any weight. I try to only use the mirror, and my clothes. I weigh in once a month or less and use a tape measure just to keep it all in perspective. Loosing 70 some pounds but gaining an inch in my arms means I dropped a lot more fat than it looks like.

I can't even do weighted chins................Damn me and not using the gym more.

J

I can't do chins normally. I started at 430ish though. Maybe more.

Ha!

He notated it for me!!!

Dutch researchers conducted an analysis of 60 trials that examined the effects of carbohydrates and various fats on blood lipid levels. In trials in which polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats were eaten in place of carbohydrates, these good fats decreased levels of harmful LDL and increased protective HDL. (

19) More recently, a randomized trial known as the Optimal Macronutrient Intake Trial for Heart Health (OmniHeart) showed that replacing a carbohydrate-rich diet with one rich in unsaturated fat, predominantly monounsaturated fats, lowers blood pressure, improves lipid levels, and reduces the estimated cardiovascular risk. (7)

Most people don't get enough of these healthful unsaturated fats each day. No strict guidelines have been published regarding their intake. The traditional Greek diet, for example, gets up to 30 percent of its calories from monounsaturated fats, mostly from olive oil. For polyunsaturated fats, the American Heart Association has set 8 to 10 percent of calories as a prudent target; there is evidence, though, that eating more polyunsaturated fat—on the order of 15 percent of daily calories—in place of saturated fat can lower heart disease risk. (

13) Since no one eats by percentage of daily calories, a good rule of thumb is to choose foods rich in unsaturated fats over foods rich in saturated fats whenever possible. (To learn more, check out this chart, Finding Foods with Healthy Fats.)

Only thing with that, they replaced carbs with fat. Which is good, only that's not a comparison between saturated fat and polyunsaturated fat.

If you read further they cover tests where they compare sat fat also. It shows there is no evidense that sat fat makes much of a difference. However they have some study material that shows just how bad "transfat" is. I try not to use the word transfat because not all true transfats have to be labeled on nutrition cards. Any trigliceride that is altered will most likely be a bad for you fat. Linked to inflamation, cancer, diabetes, trouble loosing weight etc etc etc.

My take is this, then. Cut out the bad shit. AKA transfat or hydrogenatedblablablah(circa Sean). Any fat heated past its smoking point is ruined health wise. Just don't use it. Lard/butter are more neutral if anything at all. But they are calorie dense. So if you want to look at general health eat foods high in mono/poly unsaturated fats. And that is not canola oil. Olive oil is probably the king there. If you are going to fry, use animal fat with a high smoking point.

I'll have to read it more, just looked at the blurp, but I fully agree with all that. I'm still leery about some pufa, for example:

The trial was therefore designed to study the effects not only of a more highly unsaturated oil (corn oil) but also of olive oil. It seemed likely that if any differences emerged between the olive-oil and corn-oil groups these would reflect the specific effects of polyunsaturated fatty acids.

Patients in both oil groups were instructed to avoid fried foods, fatty meat, sausages, pastry, ice-cream, cheese, cakes (except plain sponge), etc. Milk, eggs, and butter were restricted. An oil supplement of 80 g./day was prescribed, to be taken in three equal doses at meal-times. The general nature and purpose of treatment were explained, together with the fact that different patients were receiving different kinds of oil. No advice on dietary fat was give to control patients.

Eighty patients with ischaemic heart disease were allocated randomly to three treatment groups. The first was a control group. The second received a supplement of olive oil with restriction of animal fat. The third received corn oil with restriction of animal fat. The serum-cholesterol levels fell in the corn-oil group, but by the end of two years the proportions of patients remaining alive and free of reinfarction (fatal or non-fatal) were 75 %, 57 %, and 52 % in the three groups respectively.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....j02398-0041.pdf

Pretty interesting.

I also know from a chemical standpoint that unsaturated fats are more prone to oxidize because their double bond(s), but how this will actually effect your health in terms of causing buildup in arterial walls is also dependent on the rest of the diet. If your getting antioxidants from other foods then I'm presuming it can help null that possibility.

Edited April 27, 201213 yr by stefanhinote

I get where you are coming from but if the fat helps and in ways acts as an antioxidant then it is win win. Most foods with really high mono and poly protect the fats from oxidation. It wouldn't happen in the body easily as it is protected and carried by enzymes and LPA.

I completely get where you are coming from on being skeptical, that is good, but when key nutrients are mixed with the macronutrients like healthy fat and vitamin E for example, it shows that it is something we should eat.

Time to.hit the gym. Chat more later.

I get where you are coming from but if the fat helps and in ways acts as an antioxidant then it is win win. Most foods with really high mono and poly protect the fats from oxidation. It wouldn't happen in the body easily as it is protected and carried by enzymes and LPA.

I completely get where you are coming from on being skeptical, that is good, but when key nutrients are mixed with the macronutrients like healthy fat and vitamin E for example, it shows that it is something we should eat.

Time to.hit the gym. Chat more later.

Yep yep.

I get ancy to work out on rest days when I feel really good, but I gotta stick with my routine!

Decided to be a schmuck, and send a video to my friend. Did a few sets at 45lbs for chins.

Once I fall out of this "fast beginner improvement" it's going to get interesting.

You will love carbs when you get out of the beginner stage. Right after a work out.

What is your weight/height etc?