And just so we're clear, i'd love for someone to prove me wrong.. and now just prove me wrong by comparing something like a concert or giving me specs of drivers and what they're capable of.. prove me wrong by showing us, so we know it can be done. Show us installs that have it done, links, videos, pictures, stats, something other then your words and thoughts.

While I can't say whether or not a single comp set will "keep up" to your level, I've always kind of thought the way SPL guys go about it is a bit idiotic.

HLCD + large midbass would be the way to go, IMO. Much more simplistic setup, and one that actually possesses the acoustic capabilities of maintaining good, accurate sound at the same time. Imagine the possibilities of an SPL vehicle that actually imaged well and sounded good from 80hz and up! (when you weren't playing the system at 150db, as nothing will sound "good" at that output level)

For one, HLCD are capable of getting loud enough to literally deafen you. Literally, deafen you. If you think 150db of subbass is loud, consider what ~130db of midrange would sound like (if you don't know the difference in your hearing's sensitivity between subbass and midrange, look up the Equal Loudness Curve). And you'd only need ~50wpc to do it. So from about 800hz and up (for a non-minibodied horn), you won't have to worry about being "drowned out" as the HLCD should cause you physical pain long before you had any problems from the subwoofers.

Now let's look at the midwoofer. You currently have a trio of 6.5" drivers. The average 6.5" driver is going to have an Sd of around 135cm^2 from what I've seen. If we replaced the trio of 6.5's with a single 10" midbass (Sd ~345cm^2 for the 10" drivers without large subwoofer-type surrounds), you'd only lose about 15% in cone area, which for a given excursion level is a difference of only 1.4db......or just barely in the realm of noticeable audibility. There are some other things to consider, like the possibility of the 10" midbass having a larger Xmax increasing output potential in the midbass region and the possibility of lower power compression, etc. But if we just keep everything equal for the sake of discussion, the realistic difference between a single 10" midbass and a trio of 6.5" drivers is going to be almost negligible. Chances are pretty good that at the output levels you're describing, you won't notice a difference.

So there you have it. A pretty simple 4 speaker system that would be more than adequate for your output needs and actually be able to retain some semblance of good sound at lower SPL levels with the right driver selection. No, I've not built a 150db setup because SPL just doesn't interest me all that much. And no, I don't any pictures or videos to show you because for whatever reason most SPL guys don't pursue this route (my guess would be first, it's not as impressive to open a door and see 2 speakers instead of 16 [since horns aren't very visible] and two, it's a simple case of "monkey see monkey do"). But that doesn't negate anything I've said in my post. Pictures might comfort you more than numbers, but the numbers aren't wrong just because they aren't accompanied by pretty pictures. If you have a way of disputing the numbers, I'd be much more interested in that than seeing pictures.

Oh.....I do kinda have one example. RC's GN had old school horns under the dash, 12" mids in the rear quarters and a pair of 15" subs at the rear seats....it is said to have been able to do over 135db full range, which is completely different than 135db in the subbass region. A true, consistent 130db in the midrange would get very painful very quickly, and much exposure would leave you with permanent hearing damage.

So uh, Brad, how bout a link to some good horns?

So uh, Brad, how bout a link to some good horns?

ID cd1e's? http://www.imagedynamicsusa.com/products.php?Family_Id=5

So uh, Brad, how bout a link to some good horns?

A pair of good used CD2's can usually be scored for fair prices and are the highest efficiency of the lot.

Be careful with CD1e's.....the new v3 version linked above to their website use actual compression drivers, though I don't know much more about them, but the prior models used cheap piezo drivers and aren't true HLCD.

I really liked my Illusion Audio CH1's, but they are hard to find and difficult to work with as they had metal horn bodies.

Exactly and that is ONLY 2 mids and 2 tweets and will DESTROY your front stage even if you double it. Add to that it will sound WAY FUCKING BETTER.

I also don't understand the idiotic more drivers is better mentality, it has always confused me just like they confuse the stage.

Imagine the possibilities of an SPL vehicle that actually imaged well and sounded good from 80hz and up! (when you weren't playing the system at 150db, as nothing will sound "good" at that output level)

This is what I want.

Then you know what to do: multiple comp sets will not get you there

Imagine the possibilities of an SPL vehicle that actually imaged well and sounded good from 80hz and up! (when you weren't playing the system at 150db, as nothing will sound "good" at that output level)

This is what I want.

Then a good start would be researching my suggestions

OP this is what I have heard is a cheaper alternative to the Image Dynamics Horns and the route Im gonna go:

(2) of these Selenium D2500Ti-Nd-8

(2) of these Image Dynamics V.2 Full-size Horn Bodies

(2) of these adaptors Selenium Adaptors

This will save you around 300 bucks if you ever go that route, those are the same horns pretty much as the ID's below.

But when it comes to Image Dynamic HLCD the question really boils down what do you want to spend, I was gonna go with these if I went with the ID Horns:

Mini-Horns

Full-Size

As Impious stated earlier, when it comes to mids the bigger the better and not the more the better. In my next build Im looking at either a pair of 8''s or 10"s honestly.

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Hey Drew, When you gonna get some vacation time to come up here to Jacktown ??

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

r o f l.

(2) of these Selenium D2500Ti-Nd-8 ($157.50)

(2) of these Image Dynamics V.2 Full-size Horn Bodies ($181.98)

(2) of these adaptors Selenium Adaptors ($7.52)

Total: $347

Or you can get these:

http://www.woofersetc.com/p5005/CD1PRO--Image-Dynamics-Ultra-Compact-Competition-HLCD-Speaker-System.htm

Not really sure of the difference.

I am sure the pros (M5 an Impious) will have things to say

Edited December 4, 201014 yr by jmanjr

Or you could go with the B&C DE500 with the ID horn bodies and have the equivalent of the ID CD2Neo's. They are a little pricier though at around $170/driver.

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Hey Drew, When you gonna get some vacation time to come up here to Jacktown ??

I'm off alot. That's an upward drive for me. lol

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

What do you think I need?

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

What do you think I need?

Monster mids, some horns and associated eq. The last page should outline that rather well for you.

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

What do you think I need?

Monster mids, some horns and associated eq. The last page should outline that rather well for you.

Why do I need horns? And how would I mount them for good staging?

What do you mean "associated EQ"?

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

What do you think I need?

Monster mids, some horns and associated eq. The last page should outline that rather well for you.

Why do I need horns? And how would I mount them for good staging?

What do you mean "associated EQ"?

You need them because you want staging which is NOT possible with three tweeters. Usually due to the form factor you mount them under the dash.

Horns need to be "tamed" which requires some flexibility in your eq. They have more anomalies than standard tweeters, but nothing that is beyond eq to repair. If you have absolutely no eq you will need some depending on your subjective definition of how good you want it to sound.

I've already got all the mids/highs is thing. And got them for a real good deal.

Convenient so when you sell them to buy something that actually fits your needs you won't lose money

What do you think I need?

Monster mids, some horns and associated eq. The last page should outline that rather well for you.

Why do I need horns? And how would I mount them for good staging?

What do you mean "associated EQ"?

You need them because you want staging which is NOT possible with three tweeters. Usually due to the form factor you mount them under the dash.

Horns need to be "tamed" which requires some flexibility in your eq. They have more anomalies than standard tweeters, but nothing that is beyond eq to repair. If you have absolutely no eq you will need some depending on your subjective definition of how good you want it to sound.

The tweeters will be moving up to the A-Pillars. And I can see mounting a large horn there. lol

I have the 16 band EQ on mu radio?

Which is why I said associated. I don't have sigs on...but looked after your post. You will be fine with the Pio and btw you have 32 bands as the L/R are independent which will definitely help you "center" things.

Which is why I said associated. I don't have sigs on...but looked after your post. You will be fine with the Pio and btw you have 32 bands as the L/R are independent which will definitely help you "center" things.

Yeah, I know I just call it 16 band.

I will have the van torn apart soon, so I will be able to test a single set of components set up good against the bass to see how it goes.

Which is why I said associated. I don't have sigs on...but looked after your post. You will be fine with the Pio and btw you have 32 bands as the L/R are independent which will definitely help you "center" things.

Yeah, I know I just call it 16 band.

I will have the van torn apart soon, so I will be able to test a single set of components set up good against the bass to see how it goes.

It can't be a "normal" single set...you will need the efficiency of the horns with a monster midbass. Really will kick some ass then.

Which is why I said associated. I don't have sigs on...but looked after your post. You will be fine with the Pio and btw you have 32 bands as the L/R are independent which will definitely help you "center" things.

Yeah, I know I just call it 16 band.

I will have the van torn apart soon, so I will be able to test a single set of components set up good against the bass to see how it goes.

It can't be a "normal" single set...you will need the efficiency of the horns with a monster midbass. Really will kick some ass then.

I'm just wary of the horns. I've never heard a good sounding set.