mr.sagat

Yeah, I had an 18" xcon walled. The Xcon is in perfect shape sitting right beside me in my room. The wall that the Xcon was in was about 3 years old and the mdf on the port started splitting while playing woofercooker by bass hit. So, I was like F it, the Xcon is a ""SQL"" woofer, so it can't be that hard to make a louder setup. The opti's have a lot more car flex and feel louder, but on my meter I'm about 2 db quieter than my xcon was. I still need to seal off my wall, and I need to brace my port, the damn thing flexes like galloping gertie. I don't know what to do with the xcon. I really wish I had a 15, not a 18. I'm also pissed at SSA for making such a great woofer. For something that is not made to get loud, it can do it pretty well.......

This is a sad day.... A loved IA sub died.

The wall is mostly complete all i have to do is brace the box some more and seal off the wall. This was my first time putting vinyl on anything, so yeah... it turned out pretty bad.....

Yeah, it'd be nice to have more money If you have the power for them, I'd think these could be louder than comp vrs fairly easily..ebay Right now on millionbuy it seems you might be able to get 3 compvr 12"s for around $210. I would take the brutus subs over the pair of kickers, but if you have the amp wiring and power for it, get 3 of the comp vr 12's

Yeah, I also got a group 31 back there too The car has been lowered to the point the rear end is already bottomed out without any audio in it.

Holmes is right, it could be done without a head unit. All of your eqing will be done through the amps, that might get troublesome, but that is the only con I could think of.

Get anything but an optima, I've had 4 of them over the years and they are just not as reliable as a typical lead cell battery.

I would assume that since the flatlyne is a SQ woofer, it would have different preferences than the lethal injection. So yeah, email the IA dude....

under box design, you have the internal volume locked. unlock it by clicking on the override vb icon by the dimension box input area. If it still acts funny then you need to lock/unlock different measurements you entered by clicking on the letter to correspond to the measurement you want to unlock or lock.. it's tricky but easy once you get the use of it...

You need to find out the Resonant frequency of the vehicle your trying to get the 150 out of. Put a temp face over the port to completely cover it up and make the box sealed. Flatten out your eq on the headunit, disable bass boost on the amp. Do everything you can to make the response curve as flat as possible. Then play test tones on a meter and find out what the "Resonant frequency" is of your car. After you find out your peak note, tune the ported box to peak with that note. Tune the box a little bit below your peak frequency, usually about 5-7 hz lower will work fine. Here's some more suggestions, you might have done them already... Put tape on the face of the sub where the basket meets the box. If you have the money, throw some fiberglass resin in the box, sand it smooth and wax it. Make sure you have speaker wires going directly from the amp to both voice coils. Don't piggyback a six inch wire from one coil to the other. Make sure the box doesn't flex at all, you usually lose output with flexing. If you still don't get a 150 out of the mt, then port the rear deck on the car, make it look stock and don't tell anyone! hahaha

If anything I would bet the boat fiberglass would be better since it is probably a thicker material. It might be harder to work with though....

I thought that thermal capability of the coil has more to do with the gauge of the windings, what coatings, the number of layers, and the metal used, than just the size. I could see a bigger coil dissipating more heat, which would make it marginally better. I have 4 inch voice coils in my optidrive subs, but the 3 inch coil in my xcon would handle more power before thermal failure.

Cool, thanks for further explaining to me in a decent manner. I know what you mean by manipulating vids, I remember seeing a whole lot of head to head tests comparing the orion hcca versus other super woofers. The only thing I learned from it was that the hcca has a beefier coil than most other woofers, that is if the ads were actually truthful, which I kind of doubt since it was a biased assessment. The ads made it out like the hcca couldn't be stopped, wouldn't be stopped. Here's one if them... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyA-SpwwqKU

I can't argue with you because like I stated you know more than I do. In the vid they didn't have the surround on the basket? So the fact the cone should've stayed attached to the spider is irrelevant I guess. I've seen vids of subs free air wall socket burping without surrounds attached and they still didn't rip apart. You're really confusing me with the whole parameter thing. You claim that drivers can't have superior or inferior parameters. I think that is only a partial truth. Certain subs are made to perform better in certain applications. Why? Because those drivers have parameters that are better suited for that application. I can't compare the parameters of a BTL and a w7 and come to the conclusion, the btl is superior. But, if I know the intended use and install, I can look at the parameters and conclude which one has superior parameters for my intended application If I was running a 500 watt sealed home audio setup, couldn't I conclude the w7 has superior parameters over the BTL for what I need? So, it's kind of a gray area, but there would be superior/inferior parameters for everyone's install right?

ahh man, please don't do that. It's like an unwritten rule of bass that center consoles with subs are tacky. Also you're killing your seating room and it probably won't perform as well as you think it should.

With the w7 comparison I was thinking it'd only be fair for a 12w7 to be compared to the 12 xcon. Anyway, The 12w7 has 28mm xmax and the xcon has 31. How is higher power handling not a better spec? In a daily driver music setup I understand power handling capability is not everything, but If I had the choice I would prefer for a sub that has the potential to handle more power. Who knows, I might want to use it for other applications one day. A sub with more power handling capability would have versatility then. So higher power handling potential would always be a plus, unless it potentially sacrificed other aspects of the woofers performance. Sensitivity, lets say there are two subs that have the exact same parameters. Except one of them has higher sensitivity than the other. Which would you buy? Can you explain to me why you wouldn't buy the more efficient driver? Anyway, the sensitivity on the 12's I was bringing up are all almost the same, so I was wrong for bringing that up. In the SQ department, I said the Xcon imo has better SQ. What I stated was a truthful OPINION. The key words were "in my opinion" I have nothing against JL, I wouldn't run W7s unless they were given to me. It makes more sense to spend almost the same money and run two w6's instead. Anyway, here's some parameters of the xcon, 12w7 and the 2005 XXX 12. You know more than I do about audio so maybe you can enlighten me to which sub is superior on paper and why..... 2005 XXX Fs 27hz Re 1.9 DVC Qms 4.52 Qes 0.44 Qts 0.4 Sd cm2 480 Vas 56.5 Xmax 1 way 32mm BL 17.1 SPL 1W/1m 85.9 RMS 1600 W Max 2500 W Xcon 2" SSA XCON D2 Re 3.7 Ohms (1.85 per coil wired in series) Fs 32.4 Hz Qms 5.24 Qes .39 Qts .37 Mms 222 Vas 35 l Sd 480 cm^2 BL 20.65 SPL 86.7 1 W/1m Xmax 31mm RMS 1750 12w7 Free Air Resonance (Fs): 27.2 Hz Electrical “Q” (Qes): 0.514 Mechanical “Q” (Qms): 7.807 Total Speaker “Q” (Qts): 0.482 Equivalent Compliance (Vas): 2.33 cu. ft. / 66.0 liters One-Way, Linear Excursion (Xmax)*: 1.15 in. / 29 mm Reference Efficiency (no): 0.249% Efficiency (1W/1m)**: 86.2 dB SPL Effective Piston Area (Sd): 84 sq. in. / 0.0542 sq. m. DC Resistance (Re): 2.47 ohm Nominal Impedance (Znom): 3 ohm Thermal Power Handling (Pt): 1000W Driver Displacement: 0.14 cu. ft. / 4.0 liters Net Weight: 45 lbs. / 20.4 kg I guess the W7 is an Ungodly driver, I was wrong they can take a light socket like a champ. You are completely right that it set the standard. The fact it is almost a 10 year old design and you can make a valid argument about it's superiority versus today's drivers is a testament in itself.

I can't wait to see this install. So much cone area!! LMAO it's like 12 12's or something like that

Sundown is a better brand than power acoustik, no argument there. I would expect the sundown to last longer than the pa, but 10 times, get real I've owned 5 A3000DB's and never had one go out on me, so they are kind of reliable. I was comparing mofos/ a3000db to compvrs/sundown because they are in the same price range and the subs have the same cone area. Mofos against l7's is not fair, since the l7's are in a different price range and have more cone area. The CVX is basically a round L7, so that is a more fair comparison and it "might" be able to get louder than a mofo, but I really doubt it. I have owned and ran S15l7's and I respect what they can do, but the voice coil in them is really pretty weak for the monster rep you give them. I've ran a bunch of quality stuff over the years, everything from an old RE SX 18, to L7's and Cerwin Vega Strokers, to the SSA Xcon 18" I have now. They are all good drivers in their own right. But their are also subs that have a terrible rep but are actually good, anything Lanzar Optidrive, old PA Mofo's, and Audiopipe APXX's to name a few. Also, some products (JLW7) have an Ungodly rep that they don't deserve. You want more SPL? Spend half the money and be louder than the W7 You want more SQ? Save money and run almost any sub with XBLx2 Technology, like the Ascendant Audio Avalanche or the Adire Audio Tumult. Want more ""SQL""? Buy a 2004-2006 RE XXX, It'd make a W7 look retarded. Even in my town, 99% of people have a hard time believing that the SSA XCON I own is a superior driver in almost every way to the W7. It's more sensitive, handles more power, has more xmax and imo has better SQ. Oh yeah, it's half the price too.

Dude, pretty sure I'd eat you alive if I ran two older mofos. Forget that 5500d mess. I'd use The A3000DB. It's has been shown to put out over 2200 watts @ 1 ohm. The amp is also .25 ohm stable for burps. I'd be able to burp it @ .25 ohm with a pair of Dual 1 mofos, too bad you can't get such a low impedence The amp would probably put out close to 3000 watts @ .25 ohm. Shizzon used to run them, I'm sure he'd know what they can put out. A pair of mofos can hit a 150, I can't really say I've seen a pair of comp vr's, do that. Right now I am setting up my wall with 2 lanzar 15's. I would bet you systems any day that my "cheap" lanzars and that turd of a power acoustik amp is louder on a meter than your setup. Here's some underlying reasons why me with crappy power acoustik stuff would probably be louder than you. 1. I have a wall, you don't. 2. I have a meter to tweak with, I doubt you do. 3.An a3000db is already stronger than the sundown, but the a3000db would be @ .25 ohm and the sundown would be @ 1 ohm or .5 ohm (can your amp do a .5 ohm burp?) 4. The "motor assembly" of an older mofo is much, much, "stronger" than the Comp VR, so they would more than likely be louder once powered sufficiently. 5. The mofo has a 4 inch voicecoil, pretty sure the comp vr has a 2 1/2. I could almost guarantee you that if the mofos windings are of a thicker gauge wire, which I'm pretty sure they are, they will handle a ton more power than the kickers. Power acoustik is not that great, they made a few decent products, but in the whole scheme of car audio your setup isn't that great either.

not loud enough. I've put the mic on my neck before and burped 160's pretty easily....

Just reading that was terrible. He's lame for talking trash and hating for no reason and you're wrong for calling power acoustik trash. Power Acoustik has a few amps that walk all over your amp for the price in terms of power. Sub wise, the older PA Mofo 15, cost about the same as your CVR 15 and would eat it for lunch in a high power spl setup. I'm not trying to ride PA's nuts, but most brands at one time or another have made some"good" products. I'm not hating your setup, I would be proud to run your subs and amp, But if PA is "trash" and they make stuff that walks all over your setup in terms of spl, what's that really say about what you're running?

Wow!! How is it possible to kill an Xcon??? I give mine a ton of dirty ass power everyday and she hardly ever gets warm. Anyway, if you are comparing an Xcon to a Kove Armageddon, that is not a fair comparison at all. The Armageddons voicecoil can take a bullet! For the sake of SSA's rep I'd like to say I've broken a Concept CSP 18 (4000 RMS, the voice coil came apart) and never been able to make the Xcon sweat. hahaha

I would like to believe the bigger the port the better. That's not really the case though, sooner or later the port velocity is going to go down accordingly with port size and you're not going to get a gain from it. When it comes to moving a lot of air, it seems like cone area or more specifically (total displacement including excursion) would be a deciding factor. If my finances are right, I am fixing to put a 4th order wall in one of my cars. I'm pretty sure I'll be able to move hair with 2 lanzar 15's and around 2000 watts......

Yeah, that's them. From looking at the two subs, I'd say the pipes would be louder and more than likely have a beefier voice coil. The mb quart does look like a quality product that seems to be sound quality oriented. Those subs have to be a few years old though. Maxxsonics bought MB quart and like you said, Rockford designed those. Here's a pic of the 15, there not as beefy as as that one pic led me to believe. I would also be worried about how well a reversed surround will stay attached to the cone if that thing has a lot of excursion. But, they both look like solid purchases, I'd be happy with either one......

thanks man..^^ hahaha not even close man, im from sta.rosa laguna, my shop is at belair.. ^^ are you from davao? No, I'm not in Davao right now. I have some really close friends (might as well as be family, I used to live with them) That own a house in Davao City, I got to spend christmas there last year. If I ever returned in the future, I'd go to your shop, see everything. You're pretty far away.... That'd be a ton of ferries and jeepney's lol