Wow what a waste of time reading this post thus far

chris has been posting in other threads since he last posted in here. i'm calling bs on his tests

yep definately sorry guys, i didnt have my ipod there to video this and my friends younger brother was using his camera. kinda hard when your messing with volume and he is holding the meter in the kick.

i dont expect anyone to believe anything untill vids are up. we just did this for fun anyways so it doesnt really matter.

his sn is

AA-Foo

this is the only picture i took with my phone that i have.

so you don't have the footage? when do you think you will be able to get it and post it?

You'll post 'em now mister! <----My best Tackleberry impression.

No results?

Actualy, it's still uploading.  He's uploading it shot in xHD 4K so that's why it's taking a little over 2yrs to finish on youtube

If they both did the same score... that's a win for the DD. I bet the power difference is a theoretical DB difference. Probably 4k or so for the BTL and maybe 2700ish for the DD.

Unless you normalize power and enclosure alignment, you are wasting space with any type of comparison on this forum...

 

There is no such thing as a "drop in comparison".  There is a drop in evaluation of a different drivers, but you cannot compare in the same enclosure and be objective...

I really don't see what the big deal is. I mean... he isn't claiming one sub is better or louder than the other for everybody in every application.

 

He has (2) subs and a box. He's just going to see which one is louder. That's it. I don't understand why everyone is so uptight about testing shit on here.

Because there are proper ways of testing and we try to keep inaccurate testing away from here so uneducated people don't repeat what they assume to be accurate.

His test could be valid and helpful for his particular vehicle and system set up but the same power wasn't even applied to the drivers.

There are far better tools to figure out what driver is louder or better for a given set of variables.

Drop-in tests are ridiculous...

In a way they remind me of "if you peak high, build a small box". 

Because there are proper ways of testing and we try to keep inaccurate testing away from here so uneducated people don't repeat what they assume to be accurate.

His test could be valid and helpful for his particular vehicle and system set up but the same power wasn't even applied to the drivers.

There are far better tools to figure out what driver is louder or better for a given set of variables.

 

Far better tools than throwing the thing in a box and putting it on the TermLab?

 

I think not.

Which, by the way... is the proper way of testing SPL.

Basic 4th grade scientific method.  If the controls in the experiment are not constant or there is no way to insure the controls are constant the the results of the testing are inconclusive. 

 

 

And a Termlab is not an accurate DB meter it is only consistent which is why it is used.

You guys on here are a riot. For real.  

 

What "control"? He doesn't have a control in this "experiment". It's a measured A/B test on a piece of equipment that's good enough for NASA, for chrissakes. He's not curing cancer or finding dark matter. He's seeing which f'n car audio submoofer is louder on his amp in his car in that specific box. 

 

What would you like him to use as a control? And how would that control be measured?

 

Maybe you're stuck in basic 4h grade science class. But here in the grown up world, we use what we have on hand to do the best we can. If I do a drop in sub comparison and gain, you're damn tootin' that sub is louder. That's real, tangible, repeatable results.

 

I also find it hilarious that people are telling him to clamp to level the playing field with the ohm load desparity when all everyone talks about on here is that clamping is stupid and useless.

 

This is off topic, but I keep coming back here because I heard how intelligent the member base is here and how technical things can get. With an open mind, I open threads and see nothing but theoretical rhetoric that has so little traction in the real world.

 

I'm not being argumentative on purpose. I'm honestly trying to understand where you guys are coming from.

Clamp tests for burping purposes are perfectly fine as long as the meters used are accurate and all controls are measured and found to be the same. Controls are things like tone being played, sing all input voltage, power input voltage, enclosure and placement in vehicle. As long as the co trolls are the same for each transducer then you can accurately calculate results.

He is using two different impedance drivers therefore one of them will be recieving double the power. Now if the amplifier was adjusted so that wattage output was the same on each driverthen there would be no problem. But that wasn't done.

As far as clamp tests for rating an RMS rating on an amp no it is not physically possible with a couple of clamp and DM meters.

Just because "this is all you have" don't make it right to assume its ok to do.

I can't speak for anyone else here but you can look at just about any of my posts here and not find theroritical rhetoric. I work with three of the top acoustical transducer engineers in the world to ensure so.

I see. Well, I guess that's my mistake for assuming those variables remaining connstant was a given.

I won't get into the allusion to halving impedance doubles power because I know what you're getting at.

If you don't mind me asking... Whom do you consider the world's top acoustical transducer engineers?

Patrick Turnmire, Enrique Stiles, and Vance Dickason.

 

 

This is off topic, but I keep coming back here because I heard how intelligent the member base is here and how technical things can get. With an open mind, I open threads and see nothing but theoretical rhetoric that has so little traction in the real world.

 

Check Project Stupid in the build logs and see what can be done by applying ideas from the theoretical rhetoric in the real world...

 

In my simple opinion, drop-in tests are stupid simply because the box volume and tuning is not optimized. The speakers don't have identical parameters so they won't work the same in that box. Unless there's a very strict requirement to keep the box, there's no point in a drop-in test  

When did all objective thinking just go out the window on here??

 

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A DROP IN COMPARISON unless the drivers have identical T/S parameters and all inputs are normalized.  Period.  There is no argument to this.

If the btl won by say 2 whole db, people wouldn't be bitching....

No.  I would bitch if it won by .1 db, because it wouldn't be a win.  This BS on this thread does nothing but perpetuate missinformation.  This thread should have never even been started.

It should be closed, so it won't keep coming back from the dead.

Fail Thread

I really don't see what the big deal is. I mean... he isn't claiming one sub is better or louder than the other for everybody in every application.

 

He has (2) subs and a box. He's just going to see which one is louder. That's it. I don't understand why everyone is so uptight about testing shit on here.

The problem is that a "comparison" would involve controls, there are too many variables here. This is kind of a worthless test, but I understand doing it just to "do it". Not my cup of tea, but whatever. DD kind of drives me nuts though, I've never seen a company with more people clinging to a company's balls like DD fans. I've seen them do well, and I've seen them get blown outta the water, but instead of DD fanboys taking this for what it's worth, it always seems like they think that something went wrong or someone was cheating or measurement was off or some excuse. I'm not saying that's the case in this application, but man DD fans annoy the shit out of me 90% of the time. It's like  Toyota Prius, I don't hate the car, I hate the driver.