Leaderboard

i would like to apologize to the fi and ssa forums for my outbursts at other users language and additude it is not my style.....i got a bit mad and lost my head....i do not like being called a liar for no reason... to doubt me is your right as an individual.....but to just bash me and slander my name is equally wrong but none the less i offer my apology to all that i offended...

I don't know that I'd turn the gain on the amp ALL the way up. I think it would be too easy to accidentally flip the remote gain over a few notches too far and send it into clipping. I'd rather set the gain on the amp properly, then use the remote to turn it down. You'd also have a lot more finite and incremental control over the output of the subs that way.

Not on the door, but something that you can use to simulate the location. ie build something you can place as close as possible and yes, try different volumes. Start with ideal and then see how the response is, depending on what you don't like adjust from there. Personally I'd build it too large and keep shrinking it as this is much easier than the other way around

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AC1xFjGcZ7c

Cinema 4D.

I just don't agree with you guys. I have modeled many drivers similar to the BTLs over many years (mostly MTs) and I have never gone with a small box with a small vent, when I run the paramters of the early MTs I always ended up with large volume vented enclosures, never the "crappy small box with a little port" or sealed like I always hear will be modeled. Maybe it is because I know the programs well and have built many, many enclosures over the past 20 years and measured a fair share of them rarely getting results that were way, way off of the predictions. I just know from experience that you can model drivers, and if you know how to interperet the results, you can succesfully design something that meets your goals without surprises. As far as system impedance (this isn't "impedance rise" as this incorrect term is always used) you know what determains a majority of it is the various resonances as a whole the system has. If the resonance points aren't changed, enclosure shape and proximety to nearfield items does little to change anything... This is always true unless you have a gross change in shape or something so extreme that is doesn't behave correctly at all in the first place. I think too often in car audio where many people don't fully understand what is going on (I am defiently NOT refering to NDMstang here) and they fall into the "it just works that way" or it is some kind of magic BS... When in reality it isn't, in fact many things can be reliably predicted, again, if you know how to properly use the equipment at your disposal. But hell, even back in the early 90s when friends of mine had MLSSA and IMP to measure, we used to build subwoofers and bring them into our audio meetings and measure them, hell Dan Wiggins used to build stuff and bring it in... And even back then, when we didn't have anything close to what we have now, we were still able to reliably design and build stuff. I just don't see how this has changed. Anyway, we'll probably never agree on this, but that is OK, we are here to offer our different points of view. This is all I have for this thread. -Mike

OK OK OK, whoever said just let them brake in was right, and who ever said just let them play loud for a couple of hours was right. I spent the last three hours playing 20hz test tones and sine sweeps and deep bass musik, after my sub sat the my truck in 98 degree heat all day, and the lows are back as a matter of fact I'm getting the same kind of sound as I was from the 10's only I got louder lows and the bass seems to kick harder than before.

Actually, this couldn't be further from the truth. Vance Dickason did a complete experiment with this (as written up in his 6th edition) by measuring the complete T/S and enlclosure parameters of a few subwoofers in and out of vehicles. He also placed them in many positions. He could not get changes in the box parameters of more than 5% or so..... In other works, tuning, Q, impedance all stayed the same. The biggest difference in a car is cabin gain, but that doesn't alter the original box behavior/parameters in the least.... FI drivers are no different than any other drivers, if you have accurate T/S parameters, you can get predicted response just as you can with any other driver.... Put a pair of btl 15's in a 2.5 cube ported box with very little port area as the box programs suggest and see how it sounds It's going to sound like shit..and it's going to model 'fantastic' Which is why we say..put them in X volume range..with Y port range.. Using what Winisd or any other box program 'suggests' for volume and port size isn't going to work so well..it has a LOT of issues trying to predict higher and higher motor force woofers..and it simply misses the mark. If you look at it as just a reference point then it's fine. But using what is suggested works best...

Not unless your amplifier is sub-par. In which case, the best course of action is to change amplifiers. Assuming we are talking about the same amplifier, the increased power output at 2ohm compared to 8ohm would potentially improve "sound quality". (or if it was not designed to operate at 2ohms, which of course would be a problem as well)

While I agree with your premise (having available headroom is important), wiring to a higher impedance does not help one achieve that goal. If you gain "headroom" in the amplifier by wiring to a higher impedance, then the amplifier has a weak power supply that's not able to support the higher power output at the lower impedances. The amplifier itself should have zero headroom, unless it has a unique technology built into it like the RF T15kw. Otherwise, headroom in the amplifier itself is simply an indication of a weak power supply. So if you gain "headroom" in the amplifier by wiring to a higher impedance, I'd suggest you look for a new amplifier rather than change your wiring.

Yes, the Fs may drop some as a result of the Cms increasing. However, since Fs or Cms are also used to calculate Vas, Qes, Qms, and hence Qts, the net change in in-box performance will be completely inaudible. We are talking a difference in response in the same enclosure of tenths of a decibel and a tenths of hertz. So while yes, the Fs may drop some....you can not attribute a change in sound to this phenomenon since all of the other determinant parameters change in proportion to Fs aswell.

The whole point Vance Dickason made, installling the enclosure in an automobile did not change the tuning, Q or impedance in any signifigant way. It is cabin gain that really introduces the changes in response. Additionally, there probably isn't anyone on here that has measured cabin gain accurately (including myself). This would require a refence source and accurate measuring equipment. So when we are talking about changes in the few dbs or Hz, we are pretty much taking a stab in the dark when we blame it on anything but cabin gain. There isn't anything magical about loudspeaker response. T/S parameters can accurately predict the response of a loudspeaker. These calculations have been refined over literally millions of man hours over the last few decades.... When I hear things like "you can't model these drivers" all that tells me is that when modeled either the response is missunderstood, or, they have just been modeled wrong or all the modeled parameters have not been taken into account (like group delay and phase magnitude). This is also where a huge amount of the subjective sound quality of vented vs sealed debates stem from..... Or, more precisely, the missunderstanding of the whole subject...

Actually, this couldn't be further from the truth. Vance Dickason did a complete experiment with this (as written up in his 6th edition) by measuring the complete T/S and enlclosure parameters of a few subwoofers in and out of vehicles. He also placed them in many positions. He could not get changes in the box parameters of more than 5% or so..... In other works, tuning, Q, impedance all stayed the same. The biggest difference in a car is cabin gain, but that doesn't alter the original box behavior/parameters in the least.... FI drivers are no different than any other drivers, if you have accurate T/S parameters, you can get predicted response just as you can with any other driver....

We do not tolerate misinformation and lies on this forum, it will not be tolerated and if someones claims a magical sound system in a magical vehicle putting up magical numbers, we will call them out to prove it is the truth. We are men(and ladies) of fiction, lies and misconceptions are to be left on CA.com. The fact is most users here are very experienced, and we know someone who barely knows how to install a sound system is not likely to break a goal that me myself haven't broken yet. I have more woofer with more power in a similar center slot port enclosure in a trunk car with a better electrical, and I cannot break 150. It will take me a lot more work to do so.

im sorry if i pissed anyone off....

lol try and put a system in the back of a van..... see how loud you are then. I am pretty sure if I put the same system in the POS you drive, it'd break the car while do 55's lol. And we all know your lying man, just chill out. I'm not going to say your lying, although I think that you probably are. I just find it odd that you supposedly work in a car audio shop: Best way to learn how to install your own car audio - SSA Car Audio Forum Yet, you don't know what to do with a new sub: screw holes in fi bl blocked with foam?? - SSA Car Audio Forum Something doesn't seem right here...

lol at that, most people here know my GF...... At least I'm not the only one who hates you. Yours: Reputation: -25 Bad Mine: Reputation: +11 Good

the heatsink is very...dainty... overheating, breaking, i see this all in the future

Like everyone else said, you should be fine. If you are not using a box program, a nice FREE (well, it is pretty nice for free) program is WinISD. Google it and get it. Input your driver parameters. Then load your driver and begin working! Yyou can model basic enclosures, watch your output, impedance, relative phase, excursion with given input relative to frequency, port velocity, etc. It's a pretty useful tool and is much better than most free box programs.

Claiming 150's with that?......

and also no one has thought of telling you that you look like shit in all that green keep running your damn mouth....your setup dont hit and you are but hurt...bottom line...take that funk out of here

now you slander my intellect........ ok fine i have somthing to say... i stand by my apology to the fi forums and mean disrespect only to bassahaulic when i say this... but fuck you buddy straight up and flat out...fuck you.....you dont know and have no right to judge me.. only god can judge me you phony funny style faggot i dont even care if i get banned flat out you are a bitch bruh... and to hve judged my intellect and never so much as spoke a word to me in person makes you the stupid one... ps fuck you bruh Younger members? Dude more then likely, I am younger then you and him. Fact is, I only believe shit when there is proof. He had and still does not have any good evidence of his number. And the fact that he didn't know peak, and showed no evidence as to how he gained 10db with no work makes me question him. Add to that his clear lack of intelligence, and none of his story makes sense. P.S. You spelled "douche" wrong.

There are way too many posts to quote that have pissed me off. This site is worse then ca. I've seen way too many 150's it's not even funny and I'm not even a pro. Spend enough time in the lanes and that will happen. Misinformation is saying " if u do this you will get that" and not get it. Saying "I did this and got that" is not misinformation. And to say anybody on this forum could ever possibly own me would have a 2 piece in their chin just like that. I admitted I had some of my numbers wrong but i wasnt wrong. The math explains itself. This shit makes me not even want to patronize the products advertized on this board

nope, subsonic filter is dependent upon an install, not sub in general. I've done setups where the subsonic needed to be set HIGHER than the tuning frequency and i've done setups where NO subsonic was needed at all tuned in the low 30s. You set the subsonic filter by mechanical means using test tones. You don't want the sub bottoming out so don't let it. Set it at the limit you want to. Maybe you want pure quality so u set it to prevent the sub from jumping out of it's xmax rating or u just want plain loud and you would set it to right before it starts bottoming out. Subsonic filter is a preference filter like a low pass filter but is more important than a LPF because it has safety purposes as well. Adjust it by install because going by a rule of thumb can still allow a sub to bottom out or reduce potential out of your install. Also, box modeling programs do NOT work with car audio. Due to how a car is laid out, a program cannot even attempt to accurately tell you anything right... and depending on what you are using it for, even calculating port tuning can be WAY off if competing! Box modeling programs may work a lot better if your setup is installed in an environment with the least obstacles in the music room which means in an environment with the least "room gain" and attractions that can influence how the sound is reproduced. these software programs can't account for things like that and anything that can cause a gain in pressure or a room that resonates at a or certain frequencies or one that is full of obstacles will have acoustical properties that will change what any box modeling software will tell you.

Very good points! I personally don't use the remote. Better to set the gain on the amp and leave alone. OR the remote could pop out of the cord and just a thought....