shizzzon

I'm telling you you are wasting money. "the only reason i dont want to get a 2 ohm amp is because i am worried that i might get alot of protection mode problems cause the independance changes as the music plays." Impedance... And THAT'S THE WHOLE REASON i suggested a 2ohm amp because that's what you need. What you are about to do is like putting a single dual 4 ohm sub on a sundown. Those GTis share the SAME DCR value as some Dual 4 ohm subs. 1.6 ohms is plenty high. I've seen 2 ohm coils read as low as 1.2 ohms and still be fine on 2 ohm stable amps. There's nothing else to say, it's laid out for ya as simple as can be. It's your choice as to what you want.

www.amprepaircenter.com

no sub should smell or feel hot because it's hot outside. IT REALLY sounds like you are exceeding it's thermal limits because your JBL amp is probably clipping. As i stated before, you NEED to have your amp setup properly instead of visually guessing where to set the gain. IF you don't eventually get this amp set right, in the long run, you will start to have damaged speakers and end up buying new ones all the time. I know because i went through that numerous times until i finally bought the tools i needed to prevent that from happening ever again. Now, i've never damaged a single speaker because my equipment is set the way it's supposed to be. And no company will warrant burnt spiders or leads because that's considered neglect due to exceeding the thermal limits and that's exactly what's gonna happen if it keeps emitting that smell.

ah Ha! That's what i needed. So, wired in parallel, both of them would get you a 1.6 ohm load. That's perfectly fine to run off of a 2 ohm stable amp. I would be looking for a 1500w amp rated @2ohm. You'd get more bang for your buck. Here is a list of some amps that you can do your own research on that will benefit you - Alpine MRP-M2000 Kicker ZX1500.1 These amps may require you to do what bigjon said because these amps fit your application better so you'd get more power out of them than the sundown.

you should be fine. You might have slight dimming but do not worry as this will not cause failure to anything. Those alts are HIGHLY efficient. I have an alt just like that and rated for 100A stock too. I ran a 1500w amp @1ohm off stock everything and i had some dimming but never dropped below 12.5v and you will be wiring it in a way that will not even pull maximum potential out of the sundown so you have no worries. i wish i knew what the DC resistance is of those coils because it makes me wonder if a 2ohm stable amp would be more appropriate money-wise. I downloaded the manual but JBL didn't say.... Would you know by any chance what the RE value is of your subs?

I cannot find these ANYWHERE!!! I own a Klipsch Promedia 5.1 surround sound pc system. They are discontinued now and the BASH 500w amp on the back of the sub box is screwed up. IT only wants to play the subwoofer instead of the rest of the channels and apparently is a known issue from some results i've seen. Well, i wanted to just replace the amp whether it be plate\the exact same amp plate or just a 5.1 surround pc amp period! The problem is... they appear not to be sold on the market, correct? How am i to go about getting an amp to power the speakers i have that still work? I don't feel like sending the unit back, i just want to do it myself. I even looked at other 5.1 surround setups and apparently, the Klipsch is the best out there because all other 5.1 setups don't even go below 32hz... which is complete nonsense why anyone would want a setup like that. This setup i have drops to 25hz but i prefer it to go lower if i could build the setup myself... Is it possible to build a 5.1 pc system? I already have the satellites, all i would have to do is build my own sub box with the drivers i would want and an AMP!!! Anyone know anything about this and can fill me in?

Well, got some more news today- The Repair Center has stated that they are GUARANTEE-ing that when both of these amps get back to me, they will be working in perfect order. They are going to be putting in overtime to try their best to get these amps done, tested and shipped out by tomorrow. So, they will arrive here either next wednesday or next thursday. That is if nothing else goes wrong.

yea, i've been sayin it since the beginning, something isn't right if an amp is that sensitive to a slight rca issue. Apparently, there never was an issue with my setup. I install all my stuff myself so i know how things are wired and i never once doubted myself of a wiring or install error. Now, since launch date, this is the 2nd amp that is defective. abxx - when i do eventually get these damn amps back, i am testing them and comparing them to the sundown 1500d tests. In terms of performance, it will be close. In terms of reliability... The world will never know.

I did not receive my amps today... so i called and found out why. They were just about to ship them out to me last friday when they remembered that they still needed to test them strapped up... They stated that they play fine for hrs independently. So, they strap em up.... BooM! The slave amp pops AND for the first time that i am aware of has now damaged the Master amp as well! So, out of frustration, i've been without amps for over a month, driving around almost 400lbs of dead weight, no bass in the car, constant damaged amps... I am about to give up. He was muffled when he was talkin but said somethin like some blade or metal or somethin was found under the PCB which caused the slave amp(the one that always goes out) to go out which actually damaged the master this time. These amps have been worked on SO MANY times now... they better act like brand new when i get them forever. I have never had a problem with an amp ever and to find out it has been something under the board...supposedly if i heard him right. Well, i can say again that it's nothing that i am doing because they definitely replicated the problem.. Luckily, they fried them there instead of shippin em back to me and fried in my face for the 3rd time... IF that happened, hehe, i'm not even goin there. So again, when i get em back this year damage-free..., they will NEVER be strapped again. IT's too risky and too prolonged for repairs.

i didnt even know u posted. The company who made my meter said that they have never needed to re-calibrate not one of these meters with one exception of someone damaging it somehow and sent in for inspection. I REALLY REALLY WISH i could compare this to a Tlab to show guys the deal is with cheap vs pricey. The difference in the tlab and this meter is a lot- the tlab needs a pc, this meter i have needs a millivolt DMM, or an oscope. Most people have pcs or laptops so it's more adaptive. Not so many people have oscopes or millivolt DMMs. The tlab has software that is used for competition, can save scores bla bla bla... AND tells you your Db reading in realtime. The meter i have outputs a millivolt reading that you type into the software that came with it. It then calculates it for you and tells you what you hit. They give you print out sheets of what millivolt reading would read in between 90-180db in 1db increments but if u need to know the tenth, hundreth or even thousandth of a db, the software is there to find out for you. That's basically it.

I understand what he saying. He wants to band pass the playable range of these speakers since he says there is no subsonic filter on the amp. Yes you can do that. The only thing is, i do not know the roll off value of the HPF. I'm sure it's as strong as sundown's subsonic filters assuming. The thing is though, i thought you could only band pass speakers using LPF with a subsonic filter.. if all done via the amp. IF your head unit will let you LPF those subs then definitely High Pass them off the amp right around your tuning frequency or maybe even higher. The best way to do it would probably be to set the HPF way higher than necessary and start playing a note way below tuning like 20hz. Then start decreasing the HPF on the amp until you think the movement of the sub shouldnt move anymore. Any note higher than 20hz will receive more power but should also be within it's mechanical limits as well.

Ok, had a little time to work on my midbass and range and high range today. I have been complaining about the lack thereof... well, let's see what i found... Apparently... i have no phasing issue so that whole problem there saved me a lot of frustration and possible more money to correct, Thank goodness for that. So, when balance and fade are at 0, i get maximum volume as compared to shutting one or more speakers off, basically, the way it should be. Now, let's move on to the midbass area and midrange. I noticed that i had my rear 6.5s highpassed on the HU at 80hz... that would explain why i wouldnt have any decent midbass... Duh!!! So, i turned the highpass on the HU off. I run a sundown 100.4 by the way so try and follow me here- The 6.5s have a starting response at 45hz according to it's specs so i played a 45hz tone and with the oscope in my face, i started to increase the subsonic filter from 10hz to a point to where the output voltage from the amp would start to drop. I noticed that on the Sundown 100.4, 25v output seems to be the maximum output i can achieve out of a channel before clipping starts. I think just under 25v but i know that in the 25v area, i do see a small clip. Ok, back to the subsonic filter- So i keep turning it up, output voltage is running at 24.79v. I turn the filter up until the voltage backed down to 24.41v so i know now that the filter is in effect. Just out of curiosity, i decided to play a 35hz tone to see how steep the subsonic would roll off... at 35hz, output voltage was at 24.01v... not that steep at all. This was done without a load on the amp and i'll get to what happened when the speakers were on the amp but for right now, the roll off isn't that steep which may cause a mechanical problem if forgotten about... So anyways, onto setting up the amp again- The crossover settings i had were completely dumbfounded.... so i changed them all again. The only thing that was set right was the gains, hehe, the hardest part for most, hehe. So, i noticed something interesting about the Sundown 100.4. Now, i didnt measure every little note but this is what i do know- When i set the gains, i used a 1khz tone and a 600hz tone. Both notes have the same waveform and output voltage and since i used no boosts or cuts, i "assumed" the rest of the playable range would be flat too.... nope, not true. Once i dropped down to 200hz, the output of the amp started to drop. Keep in mind that the 600hz and 1khz tones, not exactly this but were measured right around 25.02v. When i got to 200hz, the output was 24.09v... Droppin a little there... I took it all the way down to 55hz. I chose 55hz because my sub box peaks at 34hz and since it's tuned low, it won't excel too great in the higher range, let's say above 50hz mostly. So 55hz is a good place to start getting the most out of my rear 6.5s. 55hz output was a lot less than 25.05v, it was somewhere around 17.7v, i was like... um, problem here... There was still another x-over active but after fixing that, it only went up to the 19v range... So, i had to use something that they told you to never use! Bass boost! The gains are set right, however i am having a filter effect in the low end. So i bass boost somewhere in the 50hz range. I VERY slowly started to turn the bass boost. I may have gotten maybe 3 little clicks on that boost and already maxed the voltage out where it wanted to start clipping again. Just a notice- Bass boost is dangerous, hehe, if used improperly. Now, these rear speakers are supposed to only play up to 4khz so let's move on to finishing bandpassing these 6.5s with the Sundown... Remember, a 1khz tone tested fine when setting the gains. I played a 2.5khz tone, output voltage just liek 1khz so fine there. I then played a 3.5khz tone and noticed the output voltage began to back off again, it dropped down to 23.78v... Luckily, that was good news for me because i needit to start rolling back off soon because i cant have these things goin full tilt too much higher. Now, onto the strange part for those who haven't seen this before- The amp is currently set on full pass playing a 4khz tone outputting 23.18v. I set the range to X10 and turn the LPF ALL the way over to 5khz. I then switch to LFP and the output voltage dropped from 23.18 down to 20.38v... But, i am within the filter's settings by far!?!? Apparently, the LPF is attacking the 4khz area even though it's set not to start rolling off until 5khz. I then played a 4.5khz tone and it rolled off even greater so for those with the amp, i am unable to sustain FULL potential output up to 5khz using the LPF setting on chan 3\4, i'm assuming chan 1\2 would do the same but never tested that for my case. Well, anyways, i needed it to roll off so it's all good there. I then hook the oscope up to the fronts and set them up. I HPF the fronts, the lowest i can go is 50hz so 50hz it is... Again, the HPF is active above 50hz in this case. Playing a 55hz tone with HPF at 50hz compared to running Full pass resulted in a loss of output voltage. But.... ding ding ding, if you remember, i also had to bass boost this low end range on chan 3\4 so i figure maybe the x-over isn't active right now? Haha, boy was i wrong. So i bass boost a little bit more than the other channels for some reason to get it to max potential... out of curiosity, i decided to play 80hz to make sure i boosted the right range.... 80hz was Pretty clipped! That means that the HPF was in fact active higher than what it says it is. I know this because i was able to see what center frequency was being boosted and the notes above this were being boosted a LOT harded that notes below it.. which the HPF was effecting... So, i readjusted the bass boost and fixed that dilemma. Again, on chan 1 and 2, i noticed that somewhere in the 3-4khz range, i get a small dip in output voltage from the amp. I do not know what it does between 4-10khz but i know it does it between 3-4khz. From 10-14khz, output voltage was the same as compared to 1khz and 600hz. This may be the amp or it may be the Head unit, who knows. So, i finally get all that done, hook all the speakers back up and time to hear some music again... I balanced and faded everything to 0 then faded and balanced different speakers and again, no phasing issue so there is only 2 things left to test, i just did one of them a while ago, the 2nd i will finish either tomorrow or sometime later if i have to do a more drastic approach to it- The last things are to test mechanical limits of the speakers- The thermal limits have been set but i gotta make sure no speakers break their mechanical limits... So, i faded everything to the front and turned it up to where i would get maximum clean output potential. Startied playing a song with some bass, perfect, clean midbass in doors non sealed. Sounded pretty nice honestly. I turned it up just one more notch into clipping and still no audible warnings as to mechanical limit fatigue, so good so far. I then go to fade all the way to the rear and start the song over. Both speakers in the rear are having "popping" issues. Too much excursion. They did this once before and i built an enclosure around them with 1\4" cardboard and non expanding foam... Apparently, the non expanding foam isn't NO where near as strong as expanding foam BUT after i created these enclosures, the popping stopped so i figured it helped because it did with the settings i had at the time. Well now, they are receiving more power because the output of the amp on the low end has been set that way via oscope. So, they will move more again. So now, i have 2 options- 1 - increase subsonic filter until they stop popping or 2 - take them off of their baffles and spray expanding foam in there this time but prevent the foam from expanding into the speaker's space by pressing it back out. Basically just using the foam as a sealer, a strong sealer. Then it should make it air-leak free. The subsonic filter option is still a toss up in the air BECAUSE, if you remember at the beginning of this post, the subsonic filter went active at 45hz but at 35hz, it had barely dropped output power. I fear that at lower notes, it may be making these speakers move WAY too much as they shouldnt be playing below 45hz anyway. So, later on, i'm gonna have to start playing notes below 45hz on them to see what's causing them to pop, or any notes further on up until i see where the frequencies begin that's making these speakers move too much. So, that's where i am at right now. Amps didnt come in today so they will probably be here tomorrow.

Ok guys. The amps are supposed to be back in wednesday but i do not think i'll be ready for them when they come in. Since i'm going to be changing some wiring configurations around and trying to get the most out of my midrange all at the same time, i am going to try and get these things setup asap but the day they come in may or may not happen. I've been trying to run these amps strapped but the slave always fails so i'm gonna run each amp to it's own sub. That's gonna involve me pulling one of the subs out of the box and rewiring everything and putting it back in.. the problem with that is the cut out for the sub is a perfect cut and has foam tape inside of the hole so unless i can perfectly balance a 50lb sub back in the hole.... it won't happen to easy. Plus, i gotta rewire my relays in a 3" hole i have to work with... that's gonna be fun in 96 degree weather. So, hopefully i can get the means to be able to get this stuff done soon so i can finally get some info about these AQ2200D amps out there to you all.

yea man, kicker's Dual coild are dispersed like a diamond One is positive, one is negative, one is positive, one is negative

Ok, i've got some things to say about the SSA Chat that nobody ever goes in... We need to make up a designated time of the day for a certain day of the week unless everyday of the week is fine where we try to flood the chat room so we can get more members here. No other Car audio forum is like SSA and on top of that, i don't recall anyone having an embedded chat service as well.... if there was one... i'd use it. I've been trying to idle in the chat for days but there is some script running that kicks me out after so many hours, lol. So, i'll make up something and everyone else can adjust this since i dont know 5,000 member's schedules... Let's start trying to do this on Wednesday's at 7pm EST. Just come in the chat and flood the hell out of the chat. We get all the frequent members in there, we can get a lot more information exchanged in this place and get to know people better. I was actually in the chat last night talkin to someone for about an hour and he was only a member for a day or two and helped him out quite a bit I believe. So, as of right now, unless someone wants to change the date or add additional dates, Wednesday, July 23rd, 2008 @ 7pm EST is where i'll be so hope to see more, a LOT more of you there as well.

take a picture

midrange

yea, i'm just tryin to see if these things can actually work in a vehicle or not. They would be 3-4ft behind your head in a 2door car if i were to install them. Does that throw the entire Front Stage off by installing them back there or no?

well, how does one go about knowing what horn works better for a certain application over another? These selenium d250x are being sold on ebay and sell in 2 or 3 different horn shapes. How would one know which is right for him? I've also heard that horns sound different than speakers... how so?

Well, let's say for music you was comparing a box tuned to 32hz small and large. Theoretically, using the small box would prevent the low end from being as loud as the larger box for the low end range. However, it's not necessarily true because i have 2 12s in a total of 4.0 NET which should be in 5.0 NET and they just destroy the low end. I'm comparing this to a single 15" install i had in a LARGE box, 7.9 cubes NET tuned even lower and the low end response from both to the ear are practically equal. A larger box may be more efficient but also can sound more muddy, less pronounced. IT's best to stick with optimal box recommendations as those sizes should give you good quality on top of good output without choosing one over the other.

okie dokie Dr Jones, hold on to your potato

what happens when playing a game when you get distracted and look in another direction and\or start thinking of something else... Our brain processes information faster than you can visually show reaction to from someone else's viewpoint.

they are not sealed up at all, no where sealed, nada, negative... I figured by running them free air HP'd around 100hz on up (if i did) wouldnt make a difference vs sealing them off. I'll try and make a temp seal soon and see if it appears louder or not. I also would like to add that i have phasing issue but do not know how to correct that either. I'm sure this happens at more than 1 note but this is just an example of what i've noticed- 1KHz tone- I'll balance the HU over to the far right. IF i fade all the way forward, it's loud. If i fade all the way back, it's the same loudness to the ear. If i fade to 0 allowing both front right and rear right to play, the output level cuts in half. That's def a phasing issue but do not know how to go about fixing that. Should i intentionally wire one of the rear speakers backwards? I'm sure that's not a good answer, there's no phase setting on the sundown amp so i dont know where to begin on that issue either.

Sounds like you're lost so i'll start you over from scratch. Tell me what the INTERNAL volume is of that box AFTER all displacements including the sub and both ports. If you do not know that volume, then go outside and measure the height, width and depth of that box. Also, measure the internal height and width of the ports and give them to me. Next, measure the length of the port. IT's not necessary to measure both as they are the same length. Next, with all this info, i will try and study your video and attempt to "guess" at the internal displacement that's in there so i can get a rough estimate as to what you are tuned to.

well, what do you suggest i do? I got the ID components installed where the factory ones were up front. Woofer in the bottom part of the door and tweeter at the top of the door. The rear fill has one 6.5" ID woofer per wall too but if i go to run my front stage mostly full passed, the rear fill is inaudible as expected. So, i let the rear fill play up to around 700hz and the fronts play from there on up. I don't want to have to do that but from what //M5 has told me and others before is that rear fill is pointless so if it is expected that i am to not get anything audible out of the rear woofers, then what should i use the other 2 channels of the sundown 100.4 for?.....