I am waiting on my sundown saz-2000d and i want new subs, i currently have 3 kicker cvx 12"s in a 6.4ft^3 @ 30 Hz. I wanted to keep my box cause its perfect and the best i built and thought about getting 3 12" Icons but dont want to underpower them. So lately i been wanting one 18" xcon or two 15" icon in a 6.15ft^3 @ 30Hz, 31Hz or 32Hz(havent made my mind up). what would be the best route, appreciate all the info.

15's, more cone area, heat dissipation, motor force, and power handling.

I vote 15s.

I vote for only one 15" Xcon. You have the space and the power with the 2000w amp! It should be perfect, and easy to do !!!

Either choice is great, but Duran has all very valid points. So I am going to agree with him. Side note, there is no such thing as under powering. In a prior install, I had a few people surprised by a single Icon 12 in a sealed 1.1 box off of 240 watts.

Either choice is great, but Duran has all very valid points. So I am going to agree with him. Side note, there is no such thing as under powering. In a prior install, I had a few people surprised by a single Icon 12 in a sealed 1.1 box off of 240 watts.

I couldnt agree with you more because my kicker cvx's have been underpowered since i had them, they have not seen no more than 700 watts rms and i love the way they sound but from previous experience with kicker i just know that when they do get louder and get the right amount of power they do start to lose their crispness plus i feel its finally time to step away from the mainstream car audio.

i went to mtx audio website about a year ago and seen their Vd calculator, where they multiply the x-max and Sd of a sub together. i have been comparing a subs Vd lately when deciding which sub or subs would be louder, is this a good calculation to go by (i do not that every install has it variables and is totally install dependent). i love to get an 18" sub cuz its just something about them but ssa recommends at least 7-8ft^3 for the xcon to shine, so if i can only give it 6.1ft^3 i should either keep my 12" setup or get the two 15" Icons(is 30Hz port tuning good for these subs).

How do the Icons compare or contrast with Fi Car Audio Q subs, cuz when i rely on the VD calculator it says the Q's would do better and i do understand that its not true accurate measurement or fact just going with what i have seen. If i am wrong about comparing a subs VD as one chaacteristic of getting a sub then please inform me, i appreciate it.

Either choice is great, but Duran has all very valid points. So I am going to agree with him. Side note, there is no such thing as under powering. In a prior install, I had a few people surprised by a single Icon 12 in a sealed 1.1 box off of 240 watts.

I couldnt agree with you more because my kicker cvx's have been underpowered since i had them, they have not seen no more than 700 watts rms and i love the way they sound but from previous experience with kicker i just know that when they do get louder and get the right amount of power they do start to lose their crispness plus i feel its finally time to step away from the mainstream car audio.

i went to mtx audio website about a year ago and seen their Vd calculator, where they multiply the x-max and Sd of a sub together. i have been comparing a subs Vd lately when deciding which sub or subs would be louder, is this a good calculation to go by (i do not that every install has it variables and is totally install dependent). i love to get an 18" sub cuz its just something about them but ssa recommends at least 7-8ft^3 for the xcon to shine, so if i can only give it 6.1ft^3 i should either keep my 12" setup or get the two 15" Icons(is 30Hz port tuning good for these subs).

How do the Icons compare or contrast with Fi Car Audio Q subs, cuz when i rely on the VD calculator it says the Q's would do better and i do understand that its not true accurate measurement or fact just going with what i have seen. If i am wrong about comparing a subs VD as one chaacteristic of getting a sub then please inform me, i appreciate it.

Mark is running his pair of 18's in approx 12 cubes, so 6.1 is fine for a single 18, but we don't suggest going any smaller. If you want to go with the single Xcon 18, go for it. And 30hz tuning is great for all three of our subs.

The Icon/Q contrast has been made a bunch of times. What it comes down to is two different ways at reaching a very similar result. The Q will have a slight advantage sealed, and the Icon slight advantage ported (that is not speaking in terms of db numbers on the TermLab, it is in reference to the specs of the drivers themselves). The Q does have the excursion advantage over the Icon, either way Icon or Q, you are getting an excellent sounding sub woofer made here in the USA.

You should read Neil's topic in the Advanced Topics section about Xmax and output.

My vote is for 2~15" Icons!!!

But this may be bias b/c I just got my 2 installed

and they sound well.....I almost blew pop out my nose

the first time they hit the lows.....LOL

I would love to have an XCON ! You,re lucky that you can run 1 or 2 beasts like that!!!!

But I must admit the 15" ICON is more than enough for my car. Even with Damplifier, sometimes I feel like my car will fall apart, or explode!!!

(I must do something for thz tunk lid rattles)

The XCON must be insane!

with that power, I vote ICON 15's, plus as mentioned you get a nice cone advantage.

2 15's FTW! Q or Icon, you will fall in love! (Or Havoc.... )

And no, Vd is not the only or best way to compare which subs will be louder. There is a sensitivity rating as well. Plus it depends on what box you put it in and what frequencies you are playing. I could go on for days about what it depends on.

Either choice is great, but Duran has all very valid points. So I am going to agree with him. Side note, there is no such thing as under powering. In a prior install, I had a few people surprised by a single Icon 12 in a sealed 1.1 box off of 240 watts.

I couldnt agree with you more because my kicker cvx's have been underpowered since i had them, they have not seen no more than 700 watts rms and i love the way they sound but from previous experience with kicker i just know that when they do get louder and get the right amount of power they do start to lose their crispness plus i feel its finally time to step away from the mainstream car audio.

i went to mtx audio website about a year ago and seen their Vd calculator, where they multiply the x-max and Sd of a sub together. i have been comparing a subs Vd lately when deciding which sub or subs would be louder, is this a good calculation to go by (i do not that every install has it variables and is totally install dependent). i love to get an 18" sub cuz its just something about them but ssa recommends at least 7-8ft^3 for the xcon to shine, so if i can only give it 6.1ft^3 i should either keep my 12" setup or get the two 15" Icons(is 30Hz port tuning good for these subs).

How do the Icons compare or contrast with Fi Car Audio Q subs, cuz when i rely on the VD calculator it says the Q's would do better and i do understand that its not true accurate measurement or fact just going with what i have seen. If i am wrong about comparing a subs VD as one chaacteristic of getting a sub then please inform me, i appreciate it.

Mark is running his pair of 18's in approx 12 cubes, so 6.1 is fine for a single 18, but we don't suggest going any smaller. If you want to go with the single Xcon 18, go for it. And 30hz tuning is great for all three of our subs.

The Icon/Q contrast has been made a bunch of times. What is comes down to is two different ways at reaching a very similar result. The Q will have a slight advantage sealed, and the Icon slight advantage ported (that is not speaking in terms of db numbers on the TermLab, it is in reference to the specs of the drivers themselves). The Q does have the excursion advantage over the Icon, either way Icon or Q, you are getting an excellent sounding sub woofer made here in the USA.

You should read Neil's topic in the Advanced Topics section about Xmax and output.

i searched for neils topic and couldnt find it, but ill keep looking for it. i see u do combo sales with the xcon and the saz-1500d, in my case would a saz-2000d be to much for the 18" xcon.

now that i read that section on xmax and output i have decided to keep my cvx's since i heard them on three different amps and i love the performance. ive heard them on 1200 watts or so in a smaller box(my car audio partners car) and they were doing a low to mid 140 db's and he was scared to crank it. so after i get the sundown i will see how they treat me and go from there, i guess i could upgrade the electrical also(thats a must). appreciate the info and thank everyone who gave their .02

^Also a good choice. I personally love CVX's.

if you ever decide to change your mind i say the 2 15's.

i think you should do it now actually if you have the money.

well i been posting and still undecided on what to do or what to get, im in the process of selling my kicker cvx's and box which I dont want to do but oh well. the only for sure company I want subs from is SSA. The choices from the topic title have changed, was gonna start a new topic but thought that would of been useless. the choice is 2-12" Icons or 1-15" Xcon on a Sundown Saz-2000d.

after redoing box measurements I came to a final design of: 4.32 Ft^3 @ 30.91 Hz with 62.50 in^2 of Port Area (Range 52-69in^2) 14.47in^2/cube

I was thinking subs up and port back between the subs(in the middle of front baffle when looking into trunk.

I personally love the lows and what to get loud, I want to get an Xcon sooo bad but everytime I read a review or see a video of Icons I change my mind and want them more.

All thoughts, opinions and .02 are appreciated.

Edited July 12, 200916 yr by jay-cee

Both will get the job done very well, but the pair of 12" Icon's have a slight advantage for output.

yeah thats what I have been thinking especially with that saz-2000d those icons would come to life, the only problem is I never had a 15" subwoofer and been wanting one plus that Xcon is wifey material. I finally got the company narrowed down after a year now I hope it doesnt last that long for which one they offer because their both great looking products with excellent reviews.

It is a tough choice, but since you mentioned output, not that the Xcon lacks in any way as proven by everyone who gives any feedback on it, the pair of 12 Icon's would have the potential to be a hair louder and you would still maintain that low octave authority.