dharris2488

I don't think anyone stated that the size of a subwoofer will determine how low it plays. The 15" Ethos sub will play the lows with much more authority than my 12" Ethos... That's what we're getting at. A 15" subwoofer will hit 25hz cleaner, louder, and more consistently than an 8" sub... I realize that I can get a 6.5" sub to play 25hz, but it won't have any "umpff" to it... And I do realize that it's all in the design of the enclosure. The T/S parameters need to be there as well, if you plan on tuning 8" subs down to 32hz. No need to pick apart the statements above...

It's looking like it will be around 45-1hr for the next video... It will show the subs and the setup better. Video is a little longer and shows much more than the last video. Should be posted soon...

This is the second video I shot and it wasn't the one I wanted to put up first. But anyway, you will get the idea. This video doesn't show the subs or the amps. Let me work on the first video I shot and hopefully I will have it posted in about an hour. The first video shows the Ethos doing their thing MUCH better than this video. For the meantime, you guys can watch this video... http://youtu.be/OYYKmYUBP1E

Oh, it's going to dig for you... I have a feeling you will be quite amazed at how low it will really go. If my 12's go as low as they do, i can't imagine what a 15 will do. Video coming in 5-10 minutes. Please keep in mind that my cosmetics ARE NOT finished. When officially completed, you will see no wires or QMat. Hopefully all you see is subwoofers and the port. I have something special planned for the wall behind my seats... Also, thinking about moving my amps to the trunk of my car once it cools down a little here in Texas. For now, they are staying in the air conditioning! The whole time i shot the video, i had my AC running! So, I know I lost some voltage, but I'm still impressed with what I was able to capture in the short video. Trying not to run them to hard right now.... That won't last long! lol.

All I'm going to say is you're going to love them... I promise. Wait till you hear how clean the lows are. I can't get over it. My enclosure is tuned to 32.5hz and they are hitting 27hz like it's nothing. I have my subsonic set at 27hz, just for protection. I was playing around earlier and turned subsonic off and I could get 23hz clean, not on heavy power though. Didn't want to destroy my drivers before I got to show them off! That's low for a 12" driver in my book...

M5, it's funny (well not funny) that you say that. My clipping indicators don't come on, but the Ethos DEFINITELY tells you when you are clipping. It's almost like the subs talk to you and say, "Push harder or WHOA man, easy with it." Every time the sub made the distortion/clipping sound (best way I can describe it, almost like a resonating sound but slightly different), not once was the clipping light on or flashing. You make a very good point and I hope others that are reading this take this very seriously. I could see how one could smoke their amp or subs fairly easy... Nothing better than the ear. Well maybe an OScope or something. I have my gains matched on all amps and the processor to the best of my ability. Now to fix the one high pass crossover issue and I can call it complete. Then, off to the store to buy the cosmetic stuff I envision in my head. Thank you everyone who has been involved in my project. Much appreciation! Video/s soon to come. One more thing... What sucks is, these subs are so heavy that there is no way I will be pulling this enclosure in and out (enclosure with drivers is around 175-200lbs). Looking back on the build now, I wish I would have built the enclosure in the car and stuck some 15's in there. That's not saying that I'm at all upset with the 12's. They really get the job done. The only thing I do regret is buying D2 coils, as I tested both of my amps out on .5ohm and they handled flawlessly. Oh well, I imagine I will recone eventually... Sorry for the long post. Just really excited!

Making a video this afternoon... Please keep in mind, I have not finished the cosmetics. I have the sound just about where I want it. I need to make some adjustments to my highs, as I need a little more "chit,chit, chit," sound (best way I can describe it). I went for a drive and played them for another 45 minutes and they keep getting better. The lows are blowing my mind! No joke. Also, I'm glad I decided to tough it out and mount the subs/port forward, because I have very minimal trunk rattle now. That was the main goal, without sacrificing too much output. Videos in a couple of hours... I will be sure to post and let everyone know when ready.

The Kicker Front Row is a processor that I'm still tinkering with. I can't say whether I like it yet or not. It's definitely not an EQ M5, but rather a digital to analog converter/crossover. It has some interesting features that I will probably NEVER use. What I do like about it is, you set your input gains to match your amplifier/s, then adjust your crossover for whatever channel you're working with. It has a 12/24/48db rolloff, so that is nice to have the option. Once you set your crossovers on all your frequencies, you turn the "output" knob all the way to max output and wait for the clipping signal to light. If it doesn't light up, then adjust your input gain slightly higher until you see the clipping indicator come on, then back off a little. What you are trying to do is keep the gains from your amp and the processor as low as possible, to reduce signal to noise ratio as much as possible... Is it a bunch of hype? Maybe... Am I in love with this thing? I don't know yet. I haven't really "tuned" everything in yet and I'm still learning all the functions of the unit. I should have an update on this processor in a day or two...

Well guys, sorry for being absent for a while... I put in some serious time to finish this project and I must say, the Ethos subs sound really solid. I went ahead and mounted them sub/port forward, cabin sealed off from the trunk. I do have some leaks that I need to find, as I can feel slight "breezes" of air when I'm in the trunk and the subs are firing. HOLY CRAP!!!! These subs LOVE TO GO LOW! I've never owned a driver that hit the upper 26hz and up so clean, loud, and what seems to me, with ease! As most already know, I have (2) Q2200's strapped providing the power to these drivers and quite honestly, I think they are laughing at the power. It's like they are telling me, more power please, more POWER please! Maybe I will sell the amps I have now, which should go fairly quick, and I might just step up and buy a Cresendo BC3500 or even the 5500. I think if I went with the 3500, I would wire down to .5ohm, as I would have to come up with something for the BC5500. I think .5ohm will be overkill with the 5500 and if wired at 2ohms, is just a waste of money in my opinion. Anyway, my point is that I need more power to these subs. I need to clamp my amps and see what kind of power I'm getting to the subs. I will update later for those that care. That's my 2 cents on these subs, take it for what it's worth. Definitely worth the every penny... If your on the fence about buying, I would say jump off and order some Ethos... What's amazing about these subs, they seem like they are at home, or very comfortable playing 30hz (many other subs seem to struggle to get below 27-28hz, but the Ethos do it with ease). To me, it seems as though they are more comfortable, take the power better, and sound more rich playing the lower tones. Like I said, I've never owned subs that play this low, so powerful and clean. Great Job Quentin! I believe, and you already know, you have a winner on your hands here. My subs only have about 45 minutes of play time on them, so I expect them to get louder and deeper over the next few days.

Thanks for the build pics. After a lot of thought and advise from multiple people on this website and in person today, I decided to mount my (2) HDS3 12's in my trunk and stuff the cavities on both sides with wood and blankets. It was sealed up good enough to see whether or not the sound would come out how I wanted. As many have stated, I did not like the way it sounded. No depth to the bass at all. Yeah, it was punchy as hell, but I don't know how I would ever get those body vibrating lows like a rear firing setup gives me. There was a huge difference. I know for a fact that my car sounds great with the subs firing toward rear and I can also really hammer out lows. I will use the rest of my QMat to put on the lid to help reduce as much rattle as possible. If there is something else I can do to help eliminate trunk rattle, I'm all ears... These two Ethos are going to pound the crap out of it. At least all the work I've put in the last couple of days to seal off the trunk, did help out tremendously with the rattles on the inside of the car. Almost no panel rattles at all. We will see what happens when I install the Ethos. I have a feeling it might be a different story. Oh well, it is what it is... Maybe one day if I do a true "SQ" build, then and only then, will I face subs/port forward. Until then, I'm a rear firing guy... I will post pics when finished. I also installed a processor today. Kicker Front Row to help balance out everything and give me a little more control over my system. I'm ready for the subs to get here so I can call this build, COMPLETE! Thanks again for all the advise guys. You helped me save a ton of time and frustration with the forward firing setup... Most of the subs I have helped install the owner preferred the sub firing into the trunk for subjective reasons. Glad you did some testing first. As far as tips on deadening the trunk. Install everything and physically touch the panels making noise. Then you will know where to brace/dampen. Rattles are an easy one, just decouple whatever is rattling. As far as panels resonating, you are more trying to shift the panels resonate frequency. You won't stop the panels from resonating, but can make them resonate at a frequency that isnt as audible, or atleast resonate to less of a degree. This is a better logic than thinking you are going to make the trunk acoustically dead. Honestly the trunk panels having a little give, opposed to being super rigid, should help the sound. Thanks for the advise... I will be moving forward as soon as I get back into town. My (2) Ethos are sitting at FedEx waiting for me to come pick them up. I'm ready to finish my business in OK City and get back home! Ready to install these and do some more testing with the Ethos. I spent this morning with Zak at SoundQubed/DD and got some ideas on how to seal the trunk off and make it look decent as well. Like I said, I have ton of motivation now and I'm ready to get back home and finish this build. Will post pics when completed, hopefully by Saturday. Thanks for your input as well M5... I will be addressing my front stage in about 1 month, as soon as I pay off what I spent on my sub stage. What would you recommend for someone like me to start looking into for front stage sound? All I have as far as EQ is concerned is the Front Row by Kicker. Not really an "EQ," but a processor that I can adjust cutoff's and crossovers. Any suggestions from you will be appreciated. My goals, as you might already know are the following: Be loud and clear, if I had to pick between Loud and Clarity, I would pick clarity slightly over just loud. As you know, I will have (2) 12" Ethos on 4400RMS (not that i'm seeing all that, or anywhere close to that), but the subs should be plenty loud. What direction should I start looking into, as far as having a decent front stage to hang with these Ethos?

Sounds good guys. I will redo test before I make anything permanent. Excited for the drivers to get here. I need to go to the DSS website and see what the cutout is for the 12" Ethos. Need to go ahead and cut holes and put the Tnuts (whatever they're called) in the back of the baffle. Going to use machine screws for these subs to get a nice and tight seal, also if I need to remove the subs for whatever reason, the wood won't be all chewed up. Ready to get this finished. Missing my bass bad!!!

So, fire it forward from the designer of the sub.... WELL, that changes things again. Back and forth, back and forth. LOL. I will fire forward and see what I can do. The Front Row processor can/should help with theloverall balance of the system. If Quentin says fire it forward, then I will. I guess I should see an increase in output then. Everything still sealed off as good as I can get it, Quentin?

I'm really glad you guys convinced me to test it out first... I don't know why I brain farted so hard because this whole time I was telling myself I had no way to test it. Low and behold, my amp was still in my car and all I had to do was put my old subs back in forward. Box is almost the same size, so everything matched up fairly well. Just not enough output, or should I say, not the kind of output I'm looking for...

Thanks for the build pics. After a lot of thought and advise from multiple people on this website and in person today, I decided to mount my (2) HDS3 12's in my trunk and stuff the cavities on both sides with wood and blankets. It was sealed up good enough to see whether or not the sound would come out how I wanted. As many have stated, I did not like the way it sounded. No depth to the bass at all. Yeah, it was punchy as hell, but I don't know how I would ever get those body vibrating lows like a rear firing setup gives me. There was a huge difference. I know for a fact that my car sounds great with the subs firing toward rear and I can also really hammer out lows. I will use the rest of my QMat to put on the lid to help reduce as much rattle as possible. If there is something else I can do to help eliminate trunk rattle, I'm all ears... These two Ethos are going to pound the crap out of it. At least all the work I've put in the last couple of days to seal off the trunk, did help out tremendously with the rattles on the inside of the car. Almost no panel rattles at all. We will see what happens when I install the Ethos. I have a feeling it might be a different story. Oh well, it is what it is... Maybe one day if I do a true "SQ" build, then and only then, will I face subs/port forward. Until then, I'm a rear firing guy... I will post pics when finished. I also installed a processor today. Kicker Front Row to help balance out everything and give me a little more control over my system. I'm ready for the subs to get here so I can call this build, COMPLETE! Thanks again for all the advise guys. You helped me save a ton of time and frustration with the forward firing setup...

Nice. I have to keep mine modular, so that may or may not work for me. But, for future sake, I'm glad you showed me a pic. Thanks again.

By the way, I'm feeling better this morning as far as frustration goes. I put in a ton of work yesterday and was tired. Then I tried to take on the framing and my brain wasn't working. That's when I know to clean up and take a break, otherwise I get sloppy or hurt... Right now, i'm just laying 2x4's as neatly as possible around the enclosure and mounting a piece of plywood in the trunk to cover it up. I would still like for it to look somewhat clean... Pictures would be great. Maybe I can pull an idea from yours? Thanks, appreciate your help... And yes, I will eventually learn the rules around here. I guess a few more ass chewing's and I will be good to go! Glad I'm a technical outside salesman who's had my balls handed to me on a silver platter on more than one occasion!

Thanks for the advise... I would love to see some pics of your sealed setup. I have a feeling my setup will be "violent" enough with the Ethos and all the power I'm putting to them. Should be fun. So, you don't feel it's necessary to foam up the surrounding edges of the enclosure? I understand what you mean about the waves, as that's why subs always sound so good in a shop. Everything changes once it gets put in a car. Yes, I would love as much loud as I can get, while keeping it musical and sounding good....

Exactly... My bad if my terminology was wrong.not your fault there are a bunch of idiots and huge stupidity on all other car audio forums Thanks for smoothing it over... I'm sure M5 does know his stuff, not questioning that. It's just hard to except something after one post, when that's what's you've always known terminology to mean. That's why I questioned it... It would be nice if M5 would ease into the point he's trying to make with a "noob," instead of coming full throttle. Did I learn something? Yeah, and it's all good and I appreciate it. I will just describe what I'm looking for from now on. I always thought SPL meant "loudness," as in sound pressure level and "SQ" or "Q" meant Sound Quality or Quality, in the broad sense of the terms. Like when trying to describe what I want for example: I want more SPL but with Quality as well. I will probably ask M5 for suggestions on what to do on the front stage of my car. I'm sure he is full of useful info... That's a couple weeks down the road when I get paid again! Now I know that doesn't fly on this site and shouldn't on others... Like I said, it's all good. I have an idea for my frame I'm going to go start working on... Catch up with you guys later.... Back to work. I'm not letting this project defeat me...

Exactly... My bad if my terminology was wrong.

You get ZERO surround from rear fill unless of course you are listening to movies or have a very odd 5.1 encoded audio collection. They sound like utter horseshit and give you sensitivity where you don't need it. MLV needs to cover the whole area and be sealed. If that matt does that why remove it? There is NOTHING special about MLV other than outside of lead it is about as dense as any sheet product. Stopping sound transmission is done with mass, so if it is really heavy you are golden. No you are not. Q&L are complete opposites, putting them together in a word is dumb. And there is NEVER a Q and multiple mids &/or Supertweets. Not even close.As for the front/rear you may not have as much output firing forward, but with eq can end up with a better result. Luckily the bass portion of an install is BY FAR the easy portion. First off, I've scratched the super tweets and multiple mids. I'm throwing ideas out, kind of thinking out loud. I will have to disagree with you as far as "SQL", because one can be loud and sound good in the process (Unless all you're out to do is bust 160). There are many systems out there that play 150 and a touch more that actually sound fairly musical. Am I going for pure SQ? No, I'm not planning on buying 2000 dollar amps and all the outrageously priced equipment that goes with that territory. Hey, if the padding I bought sounds good, then I won't remove it. I will remove it if I don't notice any difference and get the "real" stuff that has silica and whatever else they put in it. Maybe I should mount some 20lb dumb bells on the rear deck? Also, with the 6x9's reflecting off the back glass, there is plenty of rear fill. Maybe "surround" isn't the correct term to use, but you get the point. They are actually louder than my components up front. I need to dial the gain down on the amp to match them up with the front components... I'm going to keep moving forward with the front firing sub stage build and see what comes of it. Worse comes to worse, I flip the enclosure around and put another 20lbs of QMat on my trunk lid and call it good... It's not what I wish for, but if that's what I have to do, then that's what I have to do.

Thanks for the input. I think I'm about to call it a day because I'm starting to get frustrated. I'm sealed up nicely, I believe. MUCH better than before. This whole sub forward/port forward is becoming more difficult that I previously thought. I need to sleep on it and see what I'm going to end up doing. I still have 2 1/2 sheets of QMat to put on the lid of my trunk if I decide to rear fire. I wanted to do something I've never done before and I was hoping that by firing forward, i would get more SPL if sealed properly. If that's not the case, then I really need to rethink this. I'm looking for "SQL", so maybe deadening and sealing up everything I can, then rear fire may be the best choice? Kind of frustrated at the moment, so I'm going to clean up and spend some time with the wife. Maybe something will come to me later on. Basically, it's going to be a real bitch to seal the enclosure up to the car.... I know my car is loud with rear firing subs, as I have (2) HDS3 12's on a Q2200 right now and it sounds pretty damn good honestly. I wanted to take this build to the next level and I've hit a wall... MUCH PROPS TO THOSE WITH VERY SOPHITICATED SYSTEMS!!! I need some help...

Only one way to find out and that's to do it... If I don't, I will always question myself. Sometimes things don't work out, but there's nothing like the feeling when they turn out the way you intended it too. Back to the build... By the way, it's hotter than a fresh fu&Ked fox in a forest fire today! GEEEEZZZZ!!!

We shall see... Basically, if I don't like it, the only thing that needs to come out will be the frame. Then I can turn it around and let her bang away. I've just reinforced the shite out of my trunk is the way I see it. The only problem will be, the only way I can turn on the sub stage is with the seats down, or keep seats up and remove 6x9's and let the waves come up through the two opening there. I'm not really at a point to take a bunch of pictures to post up. Basically it's a ton of QMat that I got hooked up with and foam in the cracks where I physically can't reach. As soon as I get the frame built this afternoon and placed in the trunk, I will post pics of what I have. Still plenty of work to do...

Well, I hope that's not the case because I just spent nearly two days sealing up every little hole I can find. Now today I will finish building the frame. I believe my subs are arriving today, so I can go ahead and cut the holes in the enclosure and give it a full day of testing tomorrow. I need my MLV to hurry up and come in. I hope it gets to my house by next weekend. For the meantime, I bought a heavy ass rubber pad people use to stand or place heavy vibrating objects on, to install for testing purposes. I know it's not the same, but the weight, density, and makeup of whatever material they used appears to be somewhat similar. Should work for testing and will be removed and replaced by MLV... Well, it's electrical day today... Going to finish up the second run of 1/0, put the box up next to the frame, measure out how much room I have on both sides and figure out where to put amplifiers, batteries, and bus bars and wires... I sure hope this turns out right the first time! What's the odds of that?

Thanks Q... Sending email now.