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I am declaring myself intelligible for the prize, but I feel I should add my peace. This is a very sad day that I knew was coming for a while, but did not want to admit to it. Mike was and still is, one of the best people in the internet based, high end audio business. He is one of the very scant few that puts honesty and service first while realizing that it is not about massive margins made from mediocre product under over promised pretenses and fanboy hype. So let me back up a moment, Kent (mrray13), one of our very valuable long time members of SSA as was a part of how we shaped this place in the beginning, shot me a PM back in 2004 I believe. That PM essentially brought my attention to this great little brand that I knew where it was being built and I had been very familiar with what had come out of that factory. We got a hold of Mike, and come to find out he is super laid back and a great guy that was not trying to make a quick buck or push product. Once I had the chance to use Soundsplinter in my own install, I was always supportive of the great product. It is a dark day in audio when someone like Mike, has to bow out, and slimy product pushing grease ball predators are thriving. One positive piece of car audio is no longer. During a transitional stage of the SSA forums, bringing on manufacturers to the forum, (something only SoundDomain and SIN were doing at the time and look how active they are now ) Mike and SoundSplinter was a no-brainer addition. Mike was excellent at providing great info and communication even when his personal affairs were far more important. I strive to get us (SSA) to follow the standard Mike has set. Mike would never settle for a less then top end product with his logo on it. For a good while, the RL-i and RL-p was the educated choice of many, the RL-s was the choice of the nutty in the head types, but in a good way. To this day RL-i 8's fetch great money used, nearly 2 years IIRC after the last one was sold. There are some things in my audio collection that will never get sold, even in the worst of times. A signed, limited run RL-p triple slug and a BNIB RL-i 8 are apart of that going to the grave category. One last personal note, through a few rough patches in my life, Mike was always there, and that means a great deal to me. I hope people snatch up these Orphan 8's as Mike is giving them away, seriously, at this price. Mike, we wish you the best of luck and health in your future adventures, and SoundSplinter content will always remain on SSA as a reference, PM me if you would like to discuss how. Soundsplinter will always have one of the coolest logo's:

I see you did add to your original post. You only get as much as you put into something. Asking what kind of speakers you should get with no info isn't going to give you any good responses. You have alpines now. You are not going to gain much if anything at all if you stick with coaxials.

Do search on the internet and see what you find.

All I will say is: Don't watch that video and think because they metered a 149db that you can get similar results, especially on music.

2 8's would be louder then 1 10 if done correctly ,. but i think a single 10 would fit the bill better for you . im not addressing EVERYthing in each of your topics because others have input aswell...... i keep adding to your post to keep it alive,. in hopes other will join in.

lol... good info, good laughs...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-2LEY7fQR8

Padded supertweets, LOL. I got 50 supertweets in my dash and they are too "bright." How can I tone them down?

However, I expect someone from FL will prove me wrong but with a stupid reason

And I REALLY doubt that ridiculous reason can exist

And if for some RIDICULOUS reason they didn't have enough its real easy to build an Lpad in particular if you don't have to be exact

How do you "know" this? I ask because the word "underrated" seems to be thrown around a lot regarding most of these amps, but I've never seen a properly conducted bench test of any of the amplifiers posted or released. It seems most of the time people are basing this on nothing but clamp tests, which are useless for determining if an amplifier is "underrated".

That's the beauty of the electronics. It's almost infinitely adjustable.

Both of those should easily be able to deal with 10dB differences if not more

They'll be a lot more control in either of those processors than the sensitivity differences you speak of.

I missed the part where he was specifically referencing HT crossover designs for his midranges. As Ryan said.....most of what happens in HT isn't going to transfer to car audio as our environment and other constraints are so much more challenging and so much further from ideal.

With the better processors today you don't see much use in pads for car audio.

Ah ha! Do you see a huge difference between a tweeter/midbass at 88db 1w/1m and a midrange at 91db 1w/1m? I see 3db of difference Audible difference is something that you can't determine just from looking at the listed sensitivity specifications. It's going to have a lot to do with the installation (driver location, aiming, etc) and the actual FR of the speakers a long with their operating bandwidth. I wouldn't worry about a 3db difference in sensitivity, that's easily enough corrected for if necessary.

And Brad beat me to it.

What other methods are there to "pad"? I am finishing up the design on a 3-way active and the midrange has been always "padded" by other builders that used the driver in for home audio. I am concerned that I will need to do the same. You pad by adjusting the gain or level on the processor. You can throw out what has been done for HT. It in no way relates to response characteristics in the automotive environment.

Why haven't I EVER seen a build log or even mention of an l-pad for car audio? Because most people doing the build logs are either using a prebuilt passive crossover (which either has an L-pad/attenuation or it doesn't), or they are running active (where a passive L-pad isn't really necessary). Over in Europe there are some SQ competition formats which are 100% passive crossovers........those competitors probably use L-pads as they custom build all of their passives.

If you are running active you have no need for an L-pad. Adjust the gains on the necessary amplifier channels or adjust the level settings on the active crossover to properly level match the drivers.. 91db 1w/1m sensitivity is 91db 1w/1m sensitivity regardless of the impedance of the driver because it's a proper 1w/1m measurement. The only time you need to "correct" the sensitivity rating is if it's a 2.83V rating, because 2.83V results in different wattages depending on the impedance of the driver. But if it's measured at 1w, then 1w is 1w regardless of the driver's impedance.

Because the only people who would consider using them don't use them. They either switch drivers, application, or pad some other way. You would actually see them quite a bit in the early 90s.

Yes.

This is a rough stage without the tweeters installed. I need to adjust tuning a little more and add some filler pieces to the carpet.

its the same as if you were wiring two subs to one terminal. wire each sub down to 2 ohms. you'll have 2 2 ohm loads. then, wire them into a mono block amp as if the terminals were the subs and the amp were the terminal. tada, 1 ohm load

Hecks yeas brotha! Of the internet branded amps I have ran Crescendo and soon DC Audio. When I decide to buy an amplifier absolutely no factor has to do with brand name. The reviews and customer service speak for themselves. I will run Crescendo and DC Audio anytime if their product fits my build. Currently I am running JL Audio amps. Why? Because they fit my build log criteria for amps. Small. Personally I think Sundown amps are way overpriced. Here again, I am not going to buy them just because of the Sundown tag on them Hell my 3kwp was them same freak'n amp as the SAZ-3000D (ok you got me, the caps are slightly different and the voltage protection circuitry is slightly different) which costs over twice as much.

I like DC Audio amps and wouldnt mind getting one along with Everest Sound Labs (they seem to be getting a lot of buzz lately). Im not to fond of Crescendo Audio and there customer service so I wont be using them again, I have nothing against there amps. I could care less about spending money or saving money, I buy what fits my needs (space, power, reliability, features and the companys' customer service). You cant talk about Sundowns prices, like Jacob stated plenty of times his company is not an internet based brand that sells directly to the customer. If he wanted to he could and his products would be a lot cheaper to fit some poeples needs or wallets. Not justifying his prices or his company just stating facts on why it is what it is. Dealer based companies will always have higher prices then internet based companies, no matter how much the products compare to one another. The one thing I do respect about Sundown is he was having great success with Zenon boards and then started seeing companies imitate for a cheaper price, and what does Jacob do about it. He just re-tools his amp to differentiate them, while other companies are sticking with the previous boards (where's the innovation?). Honestly who cares what the next person will run in there vehicle, I didnt know now days that I had to justify my product purchases with the next man.