Sundown 2012 Cones... At The Shop!

[sundownz 197]

One of each showed up for us to check out -- will be building a 12" up first since that is the largest one I have a full size spider for. So that means I can take a video of it tomorrow !

On to the photos... they turned out way crazier than I imagined.

18" Cone

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15" Cone

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12" Cone

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10" Cone

[ricksi30 923]

Those look silly, in a pretty cool way.

[kkk4 3]

spectacular!!

[sundownz 197]

I saw some folks expressing concerns over the "SD" of the cones... here are a few photos :

* 10" Z v.3 Cone // 10" Z v.4 Cone

* 12" Z v.3 Cone // 12" Z v.4 Cone

* 12" Z v.3 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround

* 12" Z v.4 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround

* Total SD difference is only 10%

* 10" Z v.3 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround

* 10" Z v.4 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround

* The 10" frame is slightly over-sized... so it's actually slightly more SD

[ricksi30 923]

What is the point of having an over sized ten? Would it still be considered a ten when competing? I'm just curious because the 10 and 12 look so similar, and I can't imagine that enclosures would be much different between the two.

The new drivers look badass by the way.

[jonbearsmt 919]

is the 15 inch stuff still in prototype stage?

[sundownz 197]

What is the point of having an over sized ten? Would it still be considered a ten when competing? I'm just curious because the 10 and 12 look so similar, and I can't imagine that enclosures would be much different between the two.

The new drivers look badass by the way.

With the frame exactly "standard" size the spider we wanted to use wouldn't fit without over-lapping the terminals. The difference is really very marginal; no different than allowing something like a 10W7 or heck, even a square woofer (more Sd), in a 10" woofer class.

[sundownz 197]

is the 15 inch stuff still in prototype stage?

The 257mm spider isn't here yet; just waiting on that.

[ricksi30 923]

With the frame exactly "standard" size the spider we wanted to use wouldn't fit without over-lapping the terminals. The difference is really very marginal; no different than allowing something like a 10W7 or heck, even a square woofer (more Sd), in a 10" woofer class.

Makes sense, I'm a little tired haha.

[jonbearsmt 919]

is the 15 inch stuff still in prototype stage?

The 257mm spider isn't here yet; just waiting on that.

any idea of what a recone kit will be like for the NS2 with these new parts? 15

[edouble101 314]

Sundown is making "cheater" subs lol.

Seriously these things look CRAZY. I have no idea where the line is drawn for usable xmax. Soft suspensions? High FS?

[sundownz 197]

Sundown is making "cheater" subs lol.

Seriously these things look CRAZY. I have no idea where the line is drawn for usable xmax. Soft suspensions? High FS?

LINEAR x-max is generally defined as 70% BL -- I would say it's "usable" if the coil is in the gap still; not low distortion by any means but the coil is still controlled by the magnetic gap at least somewhat. Beyond that it's not really useful and just distortion, IMO, but I prefer to allow the coil to "peter out" on it's own via dropping BL than by locking up the suspension hard (if at all possible to do so within a given design). Less damaging and allows a bit more of the dynamics in a signal to get through.

[ImBob 2]

Noob question, how would you calculate SD with those dimensions taken?

[Impious 1,476]

Noob question, how would you calculate SD with those dimensions taken?

Same way you find the area of a circle.

A = Pi * r²

Radius is simply half the diameter, so to make life simple just replace "r" with Diameter/2

So for the 12" with a diameter of 23.92cm (his measurements are mm, but Sd is typically stated in cm² so we'll convert it the measurement to cm).

Pi * (23.92/2)² = ~449cm²

That's with the 1/2 surround method Jacob used. I don't know if that's what he uses in his standard T/S parameters or if that was simply to make the measurement easier. There is also a 1/3 surround standard that some companies use...mentioning that to keep in mind that Sd isn't always directly comparable unless the same measurement method was used. Jacob probably knows better than myself, but I believe the industry is trending more towards the 1/2 surround method.

[ImBob 2]

Thanks for the info Impious! One of the reasons I asked the question is because I remember reading something in the past about the surround that could confuse the issue. Now I remember the 1/2 and 1/3 talk. Either way, the insane excursion is where it's at

[jonbearsmt 919]

is the 15 inch stuff still in prototype stage?

The 257mm spider isn't here yet; just waiting on that.

any idea of what a recone kit will be like for the NS2 with these new parts? 15

no?

[sundownz 197]

is the 15 inch stuff still in prototype stage?

The 257mm spider isn't here yet; just waiting on that.

any idea of what a recone kit will be like for the NS2 with these new parts? 15

no?

I don't have the costs in for the new parts yet. Once we confirm that it's all 100% final with our factories then we'll get costs in.

[Ricci 0]

That's with the 1/2 surround method Jacob used. I don't know if that's what he uses in his standard T/S parameters or if that was simply to make the measurement easier. There is also a 1/3 surround standard that some companies use...mentioning that to keep in mind that Sd isn't always directly comparable unless the same measurement method was used. Jacob probably knows better than myself, but I believe the industry is trending more towards the 1/2 surround method.

I tend to think that 1/3rd is a little more accurate but there are tons of companies that use 1/2 too. Either way the important thing is to keep that in mind when comparing SD from different companies. I've seen drivers with large differences in the listed SD but when you get them side by side they have the same surround and cone profile.