need URGENT help with remote turn on/amp problems

[toolskizm 0]

Ok, so I'll try to keep this explanation short but informative. I have a JL 450/4 and Rockford Fosgate T20001BD. I have a NTB batter in the front...just regular battery. Going from that battery is two 4 gauge power wires. Those go into an isolator. From there the wries each have a 100amp fuse and run to the back of the car to a Optima Yellow Top. The Yellow Top is grounded 1ft. from itself to the car chassis. I have a remote wire going from the Head Unit to the back of the car. That runs into the JL amp and splits there and goes to the Fosgate. Ok so that's the setup, now heres the problem.

Ever since I got this new Fosgate amp (previously had a JL 500/1 instead) I can hook up both my amps. they both play fine, until around volume 15 out of 35. The JL amp then cuts out and goes into mute. No warning lights on the amp come on. It just mutes all the Highs. The Fosgate amp continues to play perfectly. Now, I honestly have no clue what's going on. I can unhook the remote turn on from the Fosgate amp and the JL amp will work perfect. If I connect back, the JL amps shuts down. Also, if I hook the JL amp directly to the Yellow Top, it will work. That's the JL remote turn on to Yellow Top, Fosgate Remote to the head unit. I tried testing the voltage and it's staying at 13 when the amp cuts out. I also even tried running a new remote wire from the Head Unit straight to the JL amp. When the bass starts hitting...again it shuts off. I'm really at a loss at to what the problem is.

The whole point in doing this was to try and avoid installing a relay switch as I don't want one. Would this be the only way to fix the issue? Otherwise, I have no more ideas on how I can get it to run. Strange thing is it worked perfectly with the two JL amps (450/4 and 500/1). But, for some reason with the Fosgate it's not working. Ideas PLEASE.

Edited October 14, 2007 by toolskizm

[theabunai 3]

You tested voltage on what wires when the amp cuts out ? The remote wire or the power wire ??

why not just add a relay they are easy to install, you wire it up and tuck it away...

[SouthPole1989 0]

what color light is lite on the jl because if you read your manuel the 450/4 only shuts off competely when the battery voltage goes below 10v. and all the other times it plays but bearly low. and check here: http://mobile.jlaudio.com/pdfs/Slash_amps/450_4_MAN.pdf

[toolskizm 0]

what color light is lite on the jl because if you read your manuel the 450/4 only shuts off competely when the battery voltage goes below 10v. and all the other times it plays but bearly low. and check here: http://mobile.jlaudio.com/pdfs/Slash_amps/450_4_MAN.pdf

The green power light is the only light that's on. If the amp is in mute for long enough the light will go off, and there will be no lights on. Then when the bass lets up, the amp will come back on. It works fine if it's hooked directly to the Yellow Top. I just ran a damn relay switch hooked everything up. The amp STILL does it. I honestly think there's something wrong with the amp. This is really really odd. I've tried testing the voltage on everything...just about every wire and wire configuration possible. The only way I've found the amps to work together when jamming is when the JL is directly to the Optima...the Fosgate will play no matter what I do. It doesn't care at all, but the JL does. I even tried running wires from the front battery...same thing, JL doesnt work. Heres what's screwed up too...The relay is hooked to the Yellow Top. The JL doesn't work through the relay, but if you take it out the relay and put it direct to the same battery...it works. Now, I thought it may have been a short in the wires ran or something. So I hooked some up temporarily in plain sight...still the JL amp cuts out.

I'm really at a loss...

[SouthPole1989 0]

whats the voltage on the remote wire?

[toolskizm 0]

whats the voltage on the remote wire?

13.3-13.4

I hooked the amp up direct last night just to see what would happen. I drove around and tested it..jammed hard. Neither one of the amps cut out. When I got back, I checked the voltage on the Yellow Top and it was down to 10.8...the voltage changed from 13.something to 10.8 at the isolator. Front battery was at 13 something. I actually just drove from Houston to Austin with the JL hooked up direct and the Fosgate on the switch. It played fine the whole way and I was pushing the system pretty hard for probably 2-2.5 hours. I don't know, if you need any other info to help me out...let me know. I really wanna get this fixed. Hopping in the backseat with an allen wrench every time I leave the car isn't exactly how I like my stuff set up. lol

[flakko 1]

I checked the voltage on the Yellow Top and it was down to 10.8

that right there could be your problem...thems amps werent made for 10v. gechur voltage up by either lowering the wattage or doin something to your lectrical. how big is your alternator?

[toolskizm 0]

I checked the voltage on the Yellow Top and it was down to 10.8

that right there could be your problem...thems amps werent made for 10v. gechur voltage up by either lowering the wattage or doin something to your lectrical. how big is your alternator?

The alt is not big enough. Ok, I understand my voltage is low...but I dont understand why the amp works when it's hooked up to the battery directly...but not when it's run through either a remote switch or the Head Unit remote turn on. I mean, even if I just run the wire through the switch and not even ground the switch....so pretty much like it's direct. The amp still cuts out. Could it be kuz the wire is long and the voltage already being low...when it runs through the wire and gets back to the amp, the voltage is too low?

[SouthPole1989 0]

what guage size wire are you using and btw jl amps are made to not work in 10v so the amp is fine.

[sqguy 0]

What kind of isolator....how much amperage does it handle?

If your front battery stays up and you run the HU remote to the amp it should get 13+V on the remote....there is very little current so gauge on that should matter little. I can see it turning off at 10v maybe....but then it should work fine for a song (if charged up) until the rear battery dies

[flakko 1]

i think i know whats going on...you said when you disconnect the fosgate amp, the jl suddenly works right? when you take the RF off it takes a lot of load off of your electrical system, therefore giving your JL amp more and sufficient voltage.

oh i think hes asking about power and ground wire gauge.

[toolskizm 0]

Ok, thanks for the replies guys. I'm really wanting to get this taken care of so I appreciate all the input. As for gauge wire...I have two 4 gauge power wires running from the front of the car to the rear...each has a 100 amp fuse. Gauge wire on the remote wire...it's small probably 16-18. I tried some 12 and it still cut out. The isolator...I'm not sure the brand, but it's a 200amp iso. (I didn't install that...it was from my previous system that Car Toys installed...which was a mistake). Yes, if I pull the Fosgate off the JL works. But, the JL also works with BOTH amps hooked up to the Optima if the JL is directly hooked. So if the Fosgate is pulling too much from the electrical, why does it work that way? It's still coming from the same exact place...

[SouthPole1989 0]

yea i was because of the big voltage difference. and also how is the second one grounded.( just to chassis or a negative run). either way it sounds like voltage drops are owning you.

[flakko 1]

Ok, thanks for the replies guys. I'm really wanting to get this taken care of so I appreciate all the input. As for gauge wire...I have two 4 gauge power wires running from the front of the car to the rear...each has a 100 amp fuse. Gauge wire on the remote wire...it's small probably 16-18. I tried some 12 and it still cut out. The isolator...I'm not sure the brand, but it's a 200amp iso. (I didn't install that...it was from my previous system that Car Toys installed...which was a mistake). Yes, if I pull the Fosgate off the JL works. But, the JL also works with BOTH amps hooked up to the Optima if the JL is directly hooked. So if the Fosgate is pulling too much from the electrical, why does it work that way? It's still coming from the same exact place...

hmmm have you tried replacing the isolator? have the guys at car toys switch for another isolator

[toolskizm 0]

The second batt is grounded to the chassis about a foot from itself...two 4 gauge wires. I haven't tried replacing the isolator. I'm definitely never going back to Car Toys kuz of what they did to the car previously. They'd prob charge me 500$ or some ridiculous to change the isolator.

[flakko 1]

well, for now, since it seems that the isolator seems to be the problem, just remove it and piggyback the yellowtop with the stock. don't bump TOO hard and you will be fine. just make sure to watch the voltage, because a non-starting car isnt fun.

[SouthPole1989 0]

things i would do are: upgrade all 4 guage wire to 1/0 and run a 1/0 for the ground for the second bat. and do big 3 in 1/0 guage and btw with the 2 100 amp fuses you are pulling more then 200 amps with the rockford which might be one of the reason for voltage diference also i would check those fuses, if you haven't

[toolskizm 0]

As for pulling the isolator...I'd rather not. They hadn't installed an isolator before. I used to have a JL 500/1 w/ two 10w3v3 and the 450/4. The 500/1...doesnt pull nearly as much as the Fosgate. I was always having problems with my car dying. So, they put the isolator in.

Now, FINALLY this makes since to me. I was just driving to Wal-Mart to get a few things and pick up a multimeter because I don't have one in Austin. Well I jammed hard on the way there with my lights on...JL hooked direct of course. Everything worked perfect. Got the meter and tested...the Optima was at 10.8 with the car off. So, I left and started jamming again...went somewhere where there werent alot of people and pulled over, put it in park. While it was hitting I put the meter at the switch. The batt will be at 12.3-6 or so when the bass isn't hitting. When it hits, it drops to 10 something. Ok, so I took off again and FINALLY with the JL amp hooked directly it shut off on a high bass note. So it makes since to me now...it isn't working right either way...just better when hooked direct.

I will check the fuses tomorrow when I can see. You're suggesting running TWO 1/0 gauge from the front batt to the back?? I had considered getting a 200A Iraggi alternator...I'd like to avoid it if possible, but idk what you think? If I do big 3, I'd like to almost get a new alt as it's gonna be hell to do big 3 with this car..the engine compartment is tiny. What size fuse do you think I need?

[flakko 1]

get a bigger alternator or turn the gain knob down. i think two 0 gauge wires is a little overkill, but thats just me. i would keep the 4 gauge going to the JL and go 0 gauge on the sub amp, because 300w off a 4 guage is more than enough...Plus its cheaper

[SouthPole1989 0]

the second one was for grounding the second battery. and what car is this?

[toolskizm 0]

could I not just ground the second batt to the chassis? But, also wouldn't replacing two 4 gauge for power with one 0/1 gauge kind of be pointless? I mean, wouldn't 2 4 gauge allow for the same amount of current as one 0/1? The car is a 2006 Acura RSX.

Also, which alternator you guys think I'd be ok with? I want the system to run at its full potential...but saving money is kool too lol.

180 amp / 80 amp idle $289.00

200 amp / 70 amp idle $309.00

180 amp / 100 amp idle $379.00

200 amp / 90 amp idle $399.00

Would it be necessary to get the additional lifetime warranty for 99.00?

Edited October 16, 2007 by toolskizm

[SouthPole1989 0]

you have about 2.5k rms system. so i would say get the 200 amp alt because if you get the smaller alt then you are going to need more batteries to keep the voltage up. and i want to say no on the lifetime warrenty but also email excessive amperage for a price qoute, too. and 2 4 guage is roughly about the same as 2 guage i belive. but out of those choices that you gave get the 309 doller 200 amp alt and buy a smaller pulley for it because that is the main thing that increase idle amps.

[toolskizm 0]

I'm guessing Dominick is probably at competition along with excessive amperage?

edit: woops, nevermind he just sent me a email with pricing including shipping for the alt.

Edited October 18, 2007 by toolskizm

[toolskizm 0]

You guys are probably tired of hearing about this thread, but I just observed something that I find really weird. Maybe I never took notice to this before, but anyway. Ok, so you say JL amps should cut off what, around 10-10.8. Maybe even higher right? Well surely not at 12.6? That would be ridiculous...well the amp cuts out at 12.6 and sometimes even higher voltage. So, I'm thinking maybe the amp is messed up. What you guys think? I mean, at 12.6 my lights aren't even dimming...but my amp is cutting out?!?

and yes, my voltage does drop low after hitting on it for a while, so I don't doubt I'll need an alt ne way. But still...I'm thinking my amp is acting up. I had taken it to a shop because the RCA were acting funny. If you have them connected and BARELY touch them the highs will cut out. Took it to the shop, he tried to tell me it was my RCA. So a few weekends ago, I hooked up a brand new pair straight from the deck when it was out....what do you know, amp did the same thing.

Edited October 19, 2007 by toolskizm

[theabunai 3]

Take out the isolator it serves no purpose and i think it is contributing to your low voltage...

I have a yellow top on 3K system before...

NEVER did i ever dip below 10 volts UNLESS the yellow top was not getting proper charge...

The isolator only does ONE thing... Isolate the batteries when you play the system with the car off period... It does nothing (or supposed to do nothing) when the car is on (since the alt has to charge the optima)...

You need to narrow it down somewhere...

I know for a fact dealing with JL those amps will cut out at voltages below 11volts...

I would double check all connections (the last JL amp we seen shut down was due to a lose terminal on the bat and amp, another we had a faulty fuse holder)...