SQL Suggestions

[Rubber Ninja 0]

kinda downgrading, or just changing rather from a Punch 5002 feeding 2 Punch stage1 12"

i wanna get one sub probably in a sealed box to be fed by the 5002

im looking for sq over spl, so like a more sq side LSQ sub is what im looking for. preferably <$200.

the p5002 amp can do 500Wx1 @4-ohm bridged, basically 4 ohm dvc sub right? or am i wrong

im not quite sure how the grand spectrum of products are. in my nubness, i imagine rf and jl at the expensive and prety good quality end? i'd like a sub thats quality first rather than value. how do alpine kicker jl compare? please feel free to "rip me a new one" cuz im really just a nub at this stuff.

wondering about boxes too. get some generic box or custom build one?

thanks for the help in advance

-bert

[Eldorado 0]

first off...

You would need a dual 2 ohm sub, not a dual 4.

The new kicker stuff looks pretty sweet. I would wait and see what they have to offer. The New CVX's should fit your needs. As for JL, they are a tad overpriced and Alpine subs arent really all that musical from what ive read.

As for the box, that depends on the sub. If you want to go prefab make shure its made for your sub. Custom can cost a bit more but you will get the best sound out of it vs a prefab.

[mrray13 30]

also look into the stereo integrity and soundsplinter offerings. both can be had in d2, both would love 500wrms and both are some of the best sql subs i've ever heard. not to mention mike (soundsplinter) and nick (stereo integrity) offer some of the best customer service around. price might be a bit of an issue, as it looks like ur shooting for under $200, but both companies products are well worth the price.

check into the si d2 and the soundsplinter rl-p...u won't be disappointed.

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

welcome to the site

SI is working on a second line of subs, and SoundSplinter has the RL-i's

the quality from both companies is top of the heap, the RL-i 10's might be a good choice, they are <$200, SQ is very good

[Rubber Ninja 0]

hm i was looking into kicker's products. ebay-price wise, there are a few options i could go with. since my amp is staying the same, does my choice for sub matter too much? I was thinking about the CVX, L5 and L7. all i've heard is that the square sub's hit harder? i mean i see a lot of the same RMS wattage ratings in subs of different size or just model type. Is there any rule of thumb for size and the sound the sub produces? or are they on an equal plane cuz my amp wil lbe a constant 500 for any sub?

[Eldorado 0]

usually, the larger the cone the more potential the sub has to get louder than a smaller sized woofer.

I wouldnt put the L5 and L7 in the SQ category but thats just me.

[///M5 2,833]

usually, the larger the cone the more potential the sub has to get louder than a smaller sized woofer.

I wouldnt put the L5 and L7 in the SQ category but thats just me.

Don't think he asked for an SQ sub, but if you are making a point it is a good one and I agree.

And RN, if you go out and get a 3000w rms sub and use your 500w amp it won't move it very good at all (read low SPL may have good SQ which is driver and INSTALL dependent). Matching the sub and amp together will help maximize your experience.

From your posts too it sounds like you are just looking for more boom. The first question to improve your substage I would ask is about your box. If it is some off the shelf 5/8" buffalo board box no matter what sub you have is going to sound like my butt after a week in Mexico. If you want to improve it and that includes drivers, let us know what you like/don't like what you want/don't want in the sound versus what you have now. Also a better description of your components and install would be helpful. There is no "magic" driver that sounds good in everyones car or to everyones taste. Lots of educated members here that could help drill down a good solution for you though.

edit: Doh! Just reread the post title: SQL! Comments from Eldo still stand though. Beware the definition of SQL. Most people throw it around like a solution to a problem. Good subs sound good and get loud, and loud subs can sound good.

[Rubber Ninja 0]

hm i guess im asking for the magical combination here. since my 5002 was doing 125x2 with the punch1's i was just geting 250 total. i want to use tthe 5002 to its full potential. am i going the right way by getting one sub of higher rms? right now the punch1's are im sone prefab regular sealed box and it sounds okay.

re: the magical combination. i like it loud, but i also want to precision of high quality. i listen to more than one type of music so i need something that hits hard for those bass-y rap songs and something that can just complement my speakers nicely for other types.

i have 4 pioneer 4-ways powerd by my kenwood excelon deck. i'm really pleased with the way they sound. i know i could get some better components, but im not really into that much of a hardcore set up i suppose. im happy with the pioneers as i said.

so onto the sub: is one sub advisable? or is the dual set up a must for what im looking for?

just a bit of personal opinion, i'm not to sure about square subs =\ just doenst look that nice too me. but i really wouldn't mind. but i just heard they hit hard, and if thats all they're good for i guess its not fitting? im looking into the new Kicker CVX's. the 12" has 750W Rms and my amp is going to push 500W(although i heard rf's amps push more than their rated by a bit )

the 10" has 600W, would that suit my amp better? and still hit harder than my original 2 punch1 set up? and in addition can it give me that precision i look for as well?

sigh i guess im looking for a lot out of subs and asking a lot of lame questions. i really appreciate all the help and feedback so far. you guys are a great help =]

edit: i was under the impression LSQ meant some big spl without sacrificing sq

edit2: anyone consider rf's power line? or punch3's? i heard they get a rep of hitting hard but not being able to be that clean? eh?

Edited February 28, 2006 by Rubber Ninja

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

there have been some positive reports on the T1, I got to play with one for a while at a show when they first came out, I liked them, but RF is $$$

if your looking for SQL (roughly reffered to as sound quality loud) and you like the Kickers, maybe try a CVX 12 sealed

[mrray13 30]

box is going to be the biggest improvement in this situation, as well as matching ur subs impedence to ur amps to fully utilize the amps full potential.

quick question (i'm too lazy to go back and reread this morning) is space an issue? can u build/have built a larger enclosure?

my suggestion at this point is to look into a pair of 10's or 12's and go with a low tuned ported enclosure of the proper size. soundsplinter rl-i's come to mind for the 10's, as does memphis pr 10's or 12's. the 12's will require a larger enclosure, but a pair of ported tens with 500wrms and the right box will get loud and low, and sound good doing it.

as to squares not sounding good, again install and personal taste. i run the nastiest square on the planet (solo x 18) and for all intents and purposes it sounds pretty darn good for it's application. it doesn't fatigue me to listen to it all day long.

hope that helps some more....

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

soundsplinter rl-i's come to mind for the 10's,

[dave_Edwards 1]

all this talk and no Adire or RE drivers mentioned?

[Rubber Ninja 0]

denim: the rl-i's 400rms are under my amp's rating of 500 rms and the t1 are around 200 on ebay =]. the kickers LOOK nice to me, but i cant really "try em out" dont know anyone around that has a system with the cvx or l5's.

mrray: hm. i suppose. however my plan was to like use my amp to its fullest potential. so i guess pusing 250 per channel totally 500 would be the same as pushing one 500? another question for ya'll i suppose: is there any advantage to having more subs? if one vs two is the same wattage?

as for box design. i think if i do settle on some sort of box, ill be posting stats up on the site and asking if anyone will make it for me, we can discuss payments and such.

so i guess my main question size of sub's and rms. if i have a sub that can do 750 rms but i only power 500. is that not going to sound as good as a 600 rms sub? also if i have a 600 in a 12 versus a 600 in a 10, differences?

and again 2 subs for 250rms compared to 1 at 500? maybe 500 at 1 rms? haha sigh

thanks a lot for the help guys i really appreciate it.

[mrray13 30]

dave...whoops....lol....

RN...two subs sharing 500wrms compared to one sub using 500wrms boils down to this (this is just basic stuff, for more indepth technical babble, one of the other guys will have to explain).....

1... twice the cone area(depending upon sub size, either way, you are increasing your cone area) with the same power means a potential to be louder.

2... two subs are going to be more efficient using the same power as one sub. less will be loss in heat inside the sub.

3... a few downsides. cost. depending upon model chosen, two subs will cost more then one. HOWEVER, you can also "downgrade" a little by using two. this would offset the cost a bit. but then again, by shopping around, two subs of great value could be had for just a touch more then one "super" sub.

4... enclosure size. again, depending upon sub(s) chosen, the enclosure could, in theory, end up being twice as big for two subs as it would for one. but again, one could run a pair of tens in roughly the same size enclsoure as a single twelve.

5... what you want to do. regardless of our opinions, it only matters what you are wanting, or are able, to spend on the equipment you want.

to answer your other questions, no, only pushing a 750 rated sub with 500 isn't going to change how it sounds. it will only affect overall output, and this is based upon enclosure. u can make up for a lack of power by running a slightly larger enclosure, thus making the sub more efficient. the only way you will change the sound is by clipping, or overdriving, your amplifier to compensate for spl. is a 600 rated sub better then a 750 off a 500wrms amp? in theory, yes, as you'll be closer to the optimal power of the sub in the optimal box for the power applied. but then again, your also closer to exceeding the subs limits if you are off on your enclosure.

any of you technical genius's jump in here anytime...lol...

anyway, i hope i didn't confuse you anymore then what i've already done, lol..

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

denim: the rl-i's 400rms are under my amp's rating of 500 rms and the t1 are around 200 on ebay =]. the kickers LOOK nice to me, but i cant really "try em out" dont know anyone around that has a system with the cvx or l5's.

mrray: hm. i suppose. however my plan was to like use my amp to its fullest potential. so i guess pusing 250 per channel totally 500 would be the same as pushing one 500? another question for ya'll i suppose: is there any advantage to having more subs? if one vs two is the same wattage?

as for box design. i think if i do settle on some sort of box, ill be posting stats up on the site and asking if anyone will make it for me, we can discuss payments and such.

so i guess my main question size of sub's and rms. if i have a sub that can do 750 rms but i only power 500. is that not going to sound as good as a 600 rms sub? also if i have a 600 in a 12 versus a 600 in a 10, differences?

and again 2 subs for 250rms compared to 1 at 500? maybe 500 at 1 rms? haha sigh

thanks a lot for the help guys i really appreciate it.

if you have any questions on the RL-i's Mike@soundsplinter will be a great resource,

keep in mind they are not made to win SPL competitions, just give you clean sub bass and is a treat to the ear

[///M5 2,833]

I'd rather have a 500w amp on a 400w sub than a 500w amp on a 750w sub if all other things are equal, just to have headroom in my amplifier. Also the difference between running a 500w sub on 400w or 500w is within a couple dB's--an amount I give a rats ass about especially if it is at the expense of SQ. Also, in reality how often do you listen to your system at full tilt? Mine only for seconds at a time during a "demo" for somone, or perhaps with the windows down, sunroof open, and earplugs on. Clear bumpin' music with 80db+ of road/air noise, gotta love that.

Guess what I am saying is that if you just want output, don't get the Rli's but if you aren't just looking for output don't worry about using them with your amp. Just be sure to set the gains so that you aren't clipping anything in the chain.

[Rubber Ninja 0]

alright so i thought it over a little bit. I guess i'd like to go for two subs running 250wats each with 2 ohms each. i'd like a pair of 12's again. should i just get some and try them in my generic prefab box? i realize depending on the sub, the box will be diff etc. i stumbled upon the inspection sheet for my rf p5002 amp and as you may know, rf underrates their amps. apparently mine is rated at 687 total rms watts @ 2 ohms with an actual max power of 2061.

so i guess i could do 2 chanels of 343.5 @ 2 ohms?

so now i guess im aiming a bit lower, maybe spending more on a box?

how do those comp vr's sound?

any other suggestions for a 400w sub?

[mrray13 30]

don't do comp vr's...instead do memphis pr's....less money, handle just as much power, better warranty, and IME get louder and sound better in the same box.....

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Rubber Ninja 0]

hm lookin at memphis, how about those m3 dvc's? it has the 400 rms closer to my amps real power(383wrms). or should i go with the pr, they match the original 250w rms rating on the amp?

edit: and where can i buy the memphis subs?

Edited March 3, 2006 by Rubber Ninja

[mrray13 30]

the pr's will work, the m3's are better, but of course cost more money.

there are no authorized online retailers of memphis subs, though they can be bought off of ebay. i might be able to talk a dealer friend into selling a pair cheap...i know he's selling his m1's pretty cheap if ur interested in those.

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

the new PB lines have some nice specs and since they are now built in house I would gess the price is not bad

[Rubber Ninja 0]

someone gave me this link on another forum: http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/...ad.php?t=382679

what do ya'll think of it? i think the JBL GT's look pretty nice to me. just right wattage and prety good price. but would it be that big of a step up from the rf's i have now? if RF really is just average like that list says, will i get more sq/spl aka LSQ with some jbl's?

just some food for thought

[///M5 2,833]

For being an automotive forum that is pretty good, but of course I don't like hardly anything that isn't on their highly recommended list. The JBL's can be nice, but the install will make more of a difference than the change of drivers in that case.

[mrray13 30]

read ramos's sig....

85% install, 10% product, 5% beer...

no truer statement ever written. install is everything.

that list is, well, bs. the highly recommended stuff is about all that's fairly accurate IMO...they need to remoive eDuh from it and replace it with kicker subs...lol..

kicker subs only average? ok....

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[///M5 2,833]

In my case the beer is a lot more than 5%....