What does a good or bad subwoofer sound like? Am I missing something?

[Mind Patrol 0]

Hello I'm new here and have been into car audio for a little while. My question may seem dumb and maybe its because I haven't heard enough setups or any bad subs...but I'm wondering how it is you determine what a good sounding sub and install sounds like?

Just a little background...I bought an Icon recently and built the box using the design on SSA's website and I think I did a great job for only my second box. The only two real problems were that I accidentally made the cutout for the sub 2 inches to the left in the center and it was supposed to be offset, and the second is that the port is somewhat crooked at the corner and is off by about an 1/8th of an inch. I think it sounds really good but at the same time I can't tell much of a difference as to when I had a w6 in a prefab box not too long ago. When I say I can't tell a difference I mean in SQ cause output and I think the lows are much better and I do get more punch from the Icon which I like.

My main question is that everyone talks about how the difference from prefab boxes to custom boxes is immense but I feel like the difference is not that great...so is this just me not knowing difference in quality or what?

Sorry for the long read

[shizzzon 461]

if it was a box built from JL audio, then i wouldnt consider that prefab.

Prefab in my book means generic built boxes with average volumes, but lacking in port tuning.

Most prefab boxes use ~40hz or higher tuning which may be great if you love punchy bass but will exhibit terrible low end.

Also, most prefab boxes are not internally braced which can lead to problems for those running some heavy duty subs with a lot of power on hand.

[Mind Patrol 0]

Oh no the jl was definitely in a prefab box...I bought it from a shop, it was a generic box. I mean the guy claims he doesn't carry junk boxes and his prefab boxes are really good but I'm betting any shop will say about the same about their prefab boxes

[shizzzon 461]

well.. if the specs were right for the sub then that's fine.. Nothing massive needs to be built for a W6 anyway..

I'm curious on what the specs are from the prefab vs what you built.. facts will allow us to actually analyze something.

[audio-neon 34]

Basically SQ for sub woofers is broken down into:

Transient Response, how fast can the sub reproduce bass notes without loosing clarity.

And an overall flatness or accurate reproduction of sound.

Most people call a sub woofer good based on it's ability to get loud and having any sort of decent transient response. Others call a sub woofer good for the amount of power it handles.

My main point here is, you determine what is good and bad to your ears, that's all that matters in audio. If you really want to test a subwoofer and see how it images in your sound stage, find an IASCA test cd, close your eyes and listen... Is the bass louder than the mids and highs. Not good... Can you localize the sound ( sounds like it is coming from behind you) Not good. And lastly, let it reproduce cannons, or a soft mallet bass drum roll, test it with some double bass from someone like atreyu, than pull out all of the stops and see what it can do...

Remember your ear is your guide, that is all that matters.

[Mind Patrol 0]

Well the icon is a 15 inch and I'm using the design from SSA's site for an optimal ported box so it's 4 cubic feet after displacement I think and tuned to 30hz although my couple mess ups may have messed with the tuning maybe...?

For the W6 it was a 12 and I think it sounded pretty good in that box honestly. My main complaint was that the output was lacking, it just wasn't very loud and the guy I sold it too complained of the same thing lol. I want to say that the icon hits low notes better because there are certain times in songs I'm surprised by bass notes I'm not used to hearing lol but I still don't feel like it's that big of a difference. I'm guessing the box was around 1.25 cubes and the port was pretty thin but this is all off memory. Oh and it was made of 3/4 inch mdf board if that helps

[audio-neon 34]

What were you powering the w6 with, and what are you powering the Icon with?

If it is the same amp, that could be part of the problem, or you could have an air leak somewhere in your box robbing you of output.

[Mind Patrol 0]

My main point here is, you determine what is good and bad to your ears, that's all that matters in audio. If you really want to test a subwoofer and see how it images in your sound stage, find an IASCA test cd, close your eyes and listen... Is the bass louder than the mids and highs. Not good... Can you localize the sound ( sounds like it is coming from behind you) Not good. And lastly, let it reproduce cannons, or a soft mallet bass drum roll, test it with some double bass from someone like atreyu, than pull out all of the stops and see what it...

I have tested it on some of my favorite metal songs and I'm surprised at how good it sounds and how it keeps up with the bass drums. As far as for the bass being louder than my high and mids...I would say it is but I kinda like it like that...although I know that's not really an "SQ" setup

​What were you powering the w6 with, and what are you powering the Icon with?

If it is the same amp, that could be part of the problem, or you could have an air leak somewhere in your box robbing you of output

I'm using a Sundown SAX 1200d amp for the icon and used it for the w6

Edited May 18, 2012 by Mind Patrol

[audio-neon 34]

I only brought up SQ points because you were asking how you know if a sub sounds better.

I have built one of each car (sq and spl) so far, and trust me, I LOVE bass.

[Mind Patrol 0]

Ok well my main point is that I've had kicker cvrs (sealed box), w6v2, and now an icon and the biggest difference I hear is output...as far as quality they all seamed to be "good" sounding subs to me but I know that everyone says kicker sound horrible but to me they don't seem far off from my other two (although my memory could be off because I had those like a year ago or more)

[///M5 2,833]

Kicker's don't sound horrible, people generally build shitty boxes for the Kickers. The W6 is a great sub, one of my favorites but output is not it's forte. The Icon is also a stellar driver and you state you are noticing a difference which means its rather substantial. The human ear is not good at discerning differences between output when separated by so long.

[Mind Patrol 0]

Kicker's don't sound horrible, people generally build shitty boxes for the Kickers. The W6 is a great sub, one of my favorites but output is not it's forte. The Icon is also a stellar driver and you state you are noticing a difference which means its rather substantial. The human ear is not good at discerning differences between output when separated by so long

Yeah output I definitely notice a difference, that's not what I'm wondering about. What I'm confused and wondering about is that I don't really notice much difference in terms of quality really...but that might just be because I haven't heard enough set ups and don't have a trained ear

[///M5 2,833]

You won't. The w6 is a helluva SQ style driver.

Sound quality is EASY to do with a sub and SUPER hard to get midbass. This is where almost all systems fail. Without midbass it's pointless to have a sub if your goal is truly SQ.

As for not noticing, perhaps you should feel blessed as it will help you keep your wallet.