UFO BTL worth giving up?

[SacredTanakh 67]

 

 

 

I'm after SQ, but with some aggression to it. I guess i'm greedy. If it's even relevant to the question, power will be a pair of Zed Minotaurs. Either will sit in it's optimal enclosure size, a little on the large side, with a removeable port; so I can mess with either after it's said and done.

Then sell the BTO and your big amp and go smaller. Will allow you a budget to make the front stage work. Hardly need a sub even for SQ. Sure it's important, but hardly comparatively.

Power is the last thing you should worry about. Mounting locations and install first.

The output is where i'd like it, downgrading would cost me that.

It's a better sound i'm after. I am going to at least try several new boxes for the BTL before I make any decision, or i'll never forgive myself for passing up a $250 loaded BTL 18

 

You are looking for, I fogret the proper term, forgive me, but smoothness. From your sub stage to your front stage. In order to do so, you need to get rid of your dip and values within your sub's output. You will only be able to do this by RTA/software, and with several enclousures. My advice, build large. For the BTL, this would be 8cubes NET, with plenty of port, 120-150 cuin. And tune according coherdinately with your vehicle's Transfer Function. When you have an eq on your sub, you want to bring down the peak with that your port will offer, usally around tuning, so that it blends in well with the rest of the frequency response of your sub's output. Obviously, this will bring down max SPL, but it will definately give you a better sound or the "sq" you are looking for. I hope this helps.

 

Highly recommend to not use 120-150" of port, Ive used the BTL in both 120 and 150 and It does not like a lot of port area.

[ricksi30 923]

 

I'm after SQ, but with some aggression to it. I guess i'm greedy. If it's even relevant to the question, power will be a pair of Zed Minotaurs. Either will sit in it's optimal enclosure size, a little on the large side, with a removeable port; so I can mess with either after it's said and done.

Then sell the BTO and your big amp and go smaller. Will allow you a budget to make the front stage work. Hardly need a sub even for SQ. Sure it's important, but hardly comparatively.

Power is the last thing you should worry about. Mounting locations and install first.

 

Good advice and negative votes.....I added one for you Sean. I know that you don't give a shit about your feedback as do I but it makes your post look less credible when people neg good advice.

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I want the perceived output to remain constant between 25-60hz.

Literally what I'm after.

Literally.

In a literal sense M5, as in, that's literally what I'm after. Literally.

Is that confusing? I said I'm after clean accurate sound with flat response. Even typed flat in all caps. Literally.

Thanks Sencheezy, I'll try a few boxes and mess with port area.

Other than that, I'll figure this out myself. My reputation here gets me nothing but shit. Please lock this thread.

M5, what in the fuck is the first question of this thread. Why would you pull an idea like sell my sub and downgrade out of my question. What? The? Fuck?

Are you even trying to help me or just fuck me around and make me look stupid? I'm trying to learn and you don't seem to get that I'm still forming my knowledge of audio. I'll ask stupid shit unless I already know why it's wrong. Make mistakes to progress, and learn.

I asked if I'd benefit from a switch to the ultra. I got a different answer than I expected to get, but I think Lithium helped me out quite a bit there.

You on the other hand referenced neither woofer and suggested I sell it for something smaller. Pull your head out of your ass, I have different audio goals than you. I'm after loud as fuck that doesn't sound dirty muddy or distorted.

Edited February 12, 2014 by SpeakerBoy

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I'm getting frustrated because I'm trying to ask questions an I'm getting met with questions about my questions and I'm just trying to keep this simple. Asking questions here is almost as hard as building box after box after box hoping for good luck. I'm after even flat response from 25-60hz. I'll have 3k on tap so it will have the output I need. I just want to know how to achieve FLAT

I'm not sure what is confusing about this.

My first question was whether it was worth switching out for an Ultra and the responses were enough to have me content with the btl. So now it's just about achieving flat response. I'm not sure I'm ready to deal with a front stage, because as soon as I bring that up, my woofer choice comes into question. So that's not even in the picture for now. I want to finish the subwoofer and then worry about the rest along with whatever processing is needed.

Edited February 12, 2014 by SpeakerBoy

[iwantloud 3]

I'm after SQ, but with some aggression to it. I guess i'm greedy. If it's even relevant to the question, power will be a pair of Zed Minotaurs. Either will sit in it's optimal enclosure size, a little on the large side, with a removeable port; so I can mess with either after it's said and done.

Then sell the BTO and your big amp and go smaller. Will allow you a budget to make the front stage work. Hardly need a sub even for SQ. Sure it's important, but hardly comparatively.

Power is the last thing you should worry about. Mounting locations and install first.

The output is where i'd like it, downgrading would cost me that.

It's a better sound i'm after. I am going to at least try several new boxes for the BTL before I make any decision, or i'll never forgive myself for passing up a $250 loaded BTL 18

You are looking for, I fogret the proper term, forgive me, but smoothness. From your sub stage to your front stage. In order to do so, you need to get rid of your dip and values within your sub's output. You will only be able to do this by RTA/software, and with several enclousures. My advice, build large. For the BTL, this would be 8cubes NET, with plenty of port, 120-150 cuin. And tune according coherdinately with your vehicle's Transfer Function. When you have an eq on your sub, you want to bring down the peak with that your port will offer, usally around tuning, so that it blends in well with the rest of the frequency response of your sub's output. Obviously, this will bring down max SPL, but it will definately give you a better sound or the "sq" you are looking for. I hope this helps.

Highly recommend to not use 120-150" of port, Ive used the BTL in both 120 and 150 and It does not like a lot of port area.

It likes about 120, but it needs the right amount of box space, too much and it will bottom out and too little and it will overheat. About 7.5 is right. Edited February 12, 2014 by iwantloud

[lithium 358]

I want the perceived output to remain constant between 25-60hz.

Literally what I'm after.

Literally.

In a literal sense M5, as in, that's literally what I'm after. Literally.

Is that confusing? I said I'm after clean accurate sound with flat response. Even typed flat in all caps. Literally.

Thanks Sencheezy, I'll try a few boxes and mess with port area.

Other than that, I'll figure this out myself. My reputation here gets me nothing but shit. Please lock this thread.

M5, what in the fuck is the first question of this thread. Why would you pull an idea like sell my sub and downgrade out of my question. What? The? Fuck?

Are you even trying to help me or just fuck me around and make me look stupid? I'm trying to learn and you don't seem to get that I'm still forming my knowledge of audio. I'll ask stupid shit unless I already know why it's wrong. Make mistakes to progress, and learn.

I asked if I'd benefit from a switch to the ultra. I got a different answer than I expected to get, but I think Lithium helped me out quite a bit there.

You on the other hand referenced neither woofer and suggested I sell it for something smaller. Pull your head out of your ass, I have different audio goals than you. I'm after loud as fuck that doesn't sound dirty muddy or distorted.

 

you can get a flat response with the btl. just need some EQ work. understand that you're approaching the limits of human hearing and your perception of loudness isn't as simple as what a microphone is measuring (vibrations through the body for example). 

 

also consider when listening to music that one bass note at one frequency does not necessarily have the same amplitude as another note at another frequency. so if you think that one note should be just as loud as the other while listening to the song you're wrong.

 

imo, when you're listening to this chopped or slowed music, worrying about flat response seems like a waste of time. just get the output you need, take care of the sound deadening, and knock down bad peaks. 

 

m5 said to sell your shit because you used the definition of SQ incorrectly. you've been around long enough to know what the definition entails. 

 

. I'm after loud as fuck that doesn't sound dirty muddy or distorted."

 

this very easy to accomplish. 1000$ subs and highend amps aren't need. just basic install skills. 

[lithium 358]

I'm getting frustrated because I'm trying to ask questions an I'm getting met with questions about my questions and I'm just trying to keep this simple. Asking questions here is almost as hard as building box after box after box hoping for good luck. I'm after even flat response from 25-60hz. I'll have 3k on tap so it will have the output I need. I just want to know how to achieve FLAT

I'm not sure what is confusing about this.

My first question was whether it was worth switching out for an Ultra and the responses were enough to have me content with the btl. So now it's just about achieving flat response. I'm not sure I'm ready to deal with a front stage, because as soon as I bring that up, my woofer choice comes into question. So that's not even in the picture for now. I want to finish the subwoofer and then worry about the rest along with whatever processing is needed.

 

you're worrying a lot over a little more than 1 octave. keep the install malleable. the ability to change the port tuning and so forth will definitely help. what EQ does you hu have? 

[///M5 2,833]

I want the perceived output to remain constant between 25-60hz.

Literally what I'm after.

Literally.

In a literal sense M5, as in, that's literally what I'm after. Literally.

Then why don't you literally tell us where your current setup doesn't do this!

And no, not trying to make you look stupid. Trying to help. You are not asking for what you want but what you think you want. That NEVER ends well when followed. Stop being stubborn and answer my question. It'll help you learn more than reading any other threads and give you a specific solution to address your problem. On top of that you will finally understand your own goals too.

[///M5 2,833]

Just for clarity here. You are asking an install question NOT equipment quesiton as that portion is secondary. Until you fix what is at hand you will gain nothing but another new mess by spending ANY money on gear.

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I'm after SQ, but with some aggression to it. I guess i'm greedy. If it's even relevant to the question, power will be a pair of Zed Minotaurs. Either will sit in it's optimal enclosure size, a little on the large side, with a removeable port; so I can mess with either after it's said and done.

Then sell the BTO and your big amp and go smaller. Will allow you a budget to make the front stage work. Hardly need a sub even for SQ. Sure it's important, but hardly comparatively.

Power is the last thing you should worry about. Mounting locations and install first.

The output is where i'd like it, downgrading would cost me that.

It's a better sound i'm after. I am going to at least try several new boxes for the BTL before I make any decision, or i'll never forgive myself for passing up a $250 loaded BTL 18

You are looking for, I fogret the proper term, forgive me, but smoothness. From your sub stage to your front stage. In order to do so, you need to get rid of your dip and values within your sub's output. You will only be able to do this by RTA/software, and with several enclousures. My advice, build large. For the BTL, this would be 8cubes NET, with plenty of port, 120-150 cuin. And tune according coherdinately with your vehicle's Transfer Function. When you have an eq on your sub, you want to bring down the peak with that your port will offer, usally around tuning, so that it blends in well with the rest of the frequency response of your sub's output. Obviously, this will bring down max SPL, but it will definately give you a better sound or the "sq" you are looking for. I hope this helps.

Highly recommend to not use 120-150" of port, Ive used the BTL in both 120 and 150 and It does not like a lot of port area.

It likes about 120, but it needs the right amount of box space, too much and it will bottom out and too little and it will overheat. About 7.5 is right.

I've been recommended 7.5 cubes by several different people lol. Seems to be the sweet spot.

[smashedz28 110]

I had my box built by a local guy for mine. He told me it's 8 cubes before port and it's obnoxious. Wouldn't call it very clean but tons of output.

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I understand lower is not as loud to the ear, so I'm looking to smooth that in particular out. My current setup will dig down, but as it gets lower the output decreases dramatically. Im looking for STRONG <40HZ that's where it began to suffer. It was plenty loud, just not very balanced as in the high notes had all the loudness but the low notes sounded great (just weak) . My current box is just a temp, it's 5cubes@35hz with 104sqin of port and it's nonsense. So my idea was lower tune, more port, larger box.

Edited February 12, 2014 by SpeakerBoy

[SpeakerBoy 64]

Just for clarity here. You are asking an install question NOT equipment quesiton as that portion is secondary. Until you fix what is at hand you will gain nothing but another new mess by spending ANY money on gear.

I felt I had to ask, I don't think I'll be in a position to afford an ultra for several more years after this.

Just a question of opportunity.

[///M5 2,833]

I understand lower is not as loud to the ear, so I'm looking to smooth that in particular out. My current setup will dig down, but as it gets lower the output decreases dramatically. Im looking for STRONG <40HZ that's where it began to suffer. It was plenty loud, just not very balanced as in the high notes had all the loudness but the low notes sounded great (just weak) . My current box is just a temp, it's 5cubes@35hz with 104sqin of port and it's nonsense. So my idea was lower tune, more port, larger box.

That isn't at all what you asked for before. NOT even close.

If you want to play with the box you have, the first step is to EQ down the rest. Figure out how much you've then eq'd down to balance and we can work off that.

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I understand lower is not as loud to the ear, so I'm looking to smooth that in particular out. My current setup will dig down, but as it gets lower the output decreases dramatically. Im looking for STRONG <40HZ that's where it began to suffer. It was plenty loud, just not very balanced as in the high notes had all the loudness but the low notes sounded great (just weak) . My current box is just a temp, it's 5cubes@35hz with 104sqin of port and it's nonsense. So my idea was lower tune, more port, larger box.

That isn't at all what you asked for before. NOT even close.

If you want to play with the box you have, the first step is to EQ down the rest. Figure out how much you've then eq'd down to balance and we can work off that.

On my EQ app, I drop the preamp all the way, boost 31hz back to zero and cut 63hz all the way. That's what I need to get closer to what I'm after. They are +/-10db bands. So a roughly 20db separation to even it out Edited February 12, 2014 by SpeakerBoy

[///M5 2,833]

So you are saying that 31Hz is 20dB lower than 63Hz?

FUCKING OUCH!

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I don't think it's literally that deficiencient, but yes.

See why I'm so irritated!? Lol. I have to max the eq in opposite directions to flatten the higher bass peaks. I don't want a 3kw midbass!

[SpeakerBoy 64]

I'm hoping the new box will reduce the need to eq so harshly.

The first port we build will be the 26hz port. Box at 7.5 after disp.

Edited February 12, 2014 by SpeakerBoy

[///M5 2,833]

60Hz is NOT midbass...

Do you only have 2 eq bands? You really need WAY more to determine what is going on.

[SpeakerBoy 64]

60Hz is NOT midbass...

Do you only have 2 eq bands? You really need WAY more to determine what is going on.

I have a ten band EQ.

The bottom three are 31 63 125

No,I was exaggerating by calling it a midbass. It's frustrating to have mad output on all the notes I hear the least in my music

[///M5 2,833]

60Hz is NOT midbass...

Do you only have 2 eq bands? You really need WAY more to determine what is going on.

I have a ten band EQ.

The bottom three are 31 63 125

No,I was exaggerating by calling it a midbass. It's frustrating to have mad output on all the notes I hear the least in my music

That is only 2 bands where you need them to figure things out. Obviously yours follow 1/3 octaves which simulate your hearing, but isn't narrow band enough.

[SpeakerBoy 64]

60Hz is NOT midbass...

Do you only have 2 eq bands? You really need WAY more to determine what is going on.

I have a ten band EQ.

The bottom three are 31 63 125

No,I was exaggerating by calling it a midbass. It's frustrating to have mad output on all the notes I hear the least in my music

That is only 2 bands where you need them to figure things out. Obviously yours follow 1/3 octaves which simulate your hearing, but isn't narrow band enough.

Would you consider it smarter to wait til after the new box to go out and buy an EQ? The rest of the eq is sufficient for my highs and mids for now, so I'd hate to get it and not need it.

On my iPhone I have a seven or ten band that lets you choose where the bands are. As low as twenty hz. I set a +12db at 20 and +6 @ 30 and drop 60-120 by 10db.

My GS3 is my daily phone though.

Edited February 12, 2014 by SpeakerBoy

[///M5 2,833]

How about using a laptop?

[Penguin4x4 1,761]

 

 

60Hz is NOT midbass...

Do you only have 2 eq bands? You really need WAY more to determine what is going on.

I have a ten band EQ.

The bottom three are 31 63 125

No,I was exaggerating by calling it a midbass. It's frustrating to have mad output on all the notes I hear the least in my music

 

That is only 2 bands where you need them to figure things out. Obviously yours follow 1/3 octaves which simulate your hearing, but isn't narrow band enough.

 

 

Wouldn't 31, 63, 125 be single octave steps?

[SpeakerBoy 64]

In my house, I can, but I don't have one sturdy enough to use in the car. Do you mean as a source or just for testing purposes?