Damping Factor/Slew Rate/Muddy Sound Question

[helotaxi 46]

The speakers don't know where they're installed. Speakers are speakers. The only limitation that would relegate something to home audio use would be if it were too big to fit in the car like some of the large format tweeters that would just be a pain to mount.

Damping factor is either adequate or not. 10-20 is about the level of audibility. Once you get above that there really are no sonic benefits. Of course if you're Jim you disregard it totally and run valve amps with a DF in the single digits...

[audio-neon 34]

A great mid-bass option for your budget is the MLI-65 speaker from Mach 5 audio.

36$ for a pair iirc.

[JonnieBlaze 0]

A great mid-bass option for your budget is the MLI-65 speaker from Mach 5 audio.

36$ for a pair iirc.

I just saw these on the website this morning and was curious about them. Glad to hear they are good.

I have another questions I've been wondering about. If I'm going to be upgrading all my speakers anyway, why should I buy midbass speakers, tweeters ,and crossovers seperately when I could just buy a component set that offers all three? Am I heading down the wrong path? Should I be considering component sets instead of buying everything piece by piece?

This is pretty far off topic now...I might have to start a new one in the speaker section soon.

[///M5 2,833]

You can only use dedicated midbasses if you have processing anyways so the whole search is pointless without. You can't just buy a passive crossover either and having some custom built will cost you more than many drivers. If you want to run a 3 way, it is time to start looking into active processing.

Again without knowing whether you can fit a 10" mb, 8", what depth, etc... and what processing it is really pointless to look at drivers other than to drool at all of the options.

[JonnieBlaze 0]

So component sets are not the way to go? because they include passive crossovers?

Alright, so I need active crossovers before I get the midbasses. This should not require knowledge of what vehicle I will be putting everything in, so I should be able to find crossovers that will work in my application fairly easily.

The crossovers on the amp are not going to cut it I take it. So what crossovers should I be looking at?

[JonnieBlaze 0]

Was looking around and found the Alpine PXA-H701 unit. I assume this is the sort of processing I'm looking for, but that's pretty pricey. Are there any other options that aren't so expensive? What about a good headunit that will do all the processing without needing another external unit? Is there anything like that?

[audio-neon 34]

Rockford Fosgate 360.2

or you could just get a pioneer 880prs or an elcipse 7200 mkII

[///M5 2,833]

I'd still say processing depends on the vehicle and whether you can fit a 3 way and what size drivers and aiming. It makes a HUGE difference in fact.

[JonnieBlaze 0]

Ok...

I got a 2000 Dodge Neon for my commuting car. Speaker sizes are: 6.5x3 in door, 3.5x2 in dash, 6x9xwhatever in rear deck. I plan on removing the 6x9s and building my box for my sundown e8's into the rear deck. Speakers in the rear are kinda pointless anyway right?

So processing first right? Now that you know what kind of car it is, what would you suggest? I think I want to stick with a separate unit like that RF 360.2 so that it doesnt matter what headunit i get, I can still have good processing. I doubt I will do this, but there is a possibility I'll build a car pc and that would have no processing I figure, so a separate unit would be a must. My problem is the RF 360.2 is so expensive. Even on ebay it is over 300 dollars. Are there any other options? I dont need/want the best of the best. This will be my daily driver and I just want something that will sound good.

[///M5 2,833]

Offboard procs start around $300. There is cheaper, but not with nearly the flexibility. Either get a headunit that can do what you want or pony up for the extra proc.

Is 3" in depth all you can muster? Is that with the mounting baffle?

[JonnieBlaze 0]

I looked up the vehicle online somewhere and that's what it listed. I've always wanted to try making a fiberglass panel...so I'd say the 3" depth is very negotiable. I know for a fact they can come further into the cabin away from the door another 2 inches before they would get in the way. I can find out exactly how much I have inside the door tonight.

So what are some other processing units that might work in my case?

Edited June 9, 2008 by JonnieBlaze

[JonnieBlaze 0]

What if I just get the pioneer 800prs as suggested above? That will do the processing I need correct? And it has inputs so if I do decide to go the carpc route later on, I can still use the HU for my processing correct? Or is this a bad idea....

I need a new headunit anyway, my old alpine doesnt eject cd's anymore and it is staying in my truck anyway.

[KU40 173]

I always get so confused when the Rockford 360.2 gets mentioned because I think of it as an amp, not a processor. Didn't they make an amp with that exact number? I know they made a 360a2, not sure if that particular amp made it into when they started using . instead of a.

[JonnieBlaze 0]

Yeah, there is a 360.2 amp on ebay right now. Not sure if that's really what it is supposed to be called (360.2) but its there.

I measured my mounting depth in my front doors. 2 inches with no baffle. 3 inches with stock plastic baffle. Making my own baffle I can bring it out to about 4 or 4.5 inches. 4 would be best, less likely to be kicked, and 4.5 is doable, and 5 is just pushing it. 5 would be doable if I put some good strong grilles in front of the speaker.

I went to the local shop today and looked at the eclipse 7200 and alpine 9887. I did not like the eclipse...the little background pictures and movement ticked me off cuz I could barely see the readout on top of the background. The alpine seemed pretty awesome, but a great deal cheaper. Not sure if that shows that its not a top of the line HU or not. But it was very straight forward and plain, not much background movement and easy to read. I couldnt find the pioneer 800 prs anywhere in town. I really wanted to see that one.

So which head unit do you all suggest? I want something with axillary rca inputs, good processing, usb would be nice so I could attach a small harddrive to it, and a plain easy to read display without fighter jets flying around in the background cough*eclipse*cough. Bluetooth and Ipod control seems nice, but is not on my priority list.

Edited June 10, 2008 by JonnieBlaze

[helotaxi 46]

Yeah, there is a 360.2 amp on ebay right now. Not sure if that's really what it is supposed to be called (360.2) but its there.

I measured my mounting depth in my front doors. 2 inches with no baffle. 3 inches with stock plastic baffle. Making my own baffle I can bring it out to about 4 or 4.5 inches. 4 would be best, less likely to be kicked, and 4.5 is doable, and 5 is just pushing it. 5 would be doable if I put some good strong grilles in front of the speaker.

Is the 2000 Neon the same body style as the '03? I have a set of buildouts built into the lower door panel that I'm replacing. If you're not in a hurry I'll be back in the States in early August and would let them go for really cheap. Matching set of tweeter mounts for the a-pillar, too.

[JonnieBlaze 0]

I'm not sure if they are the same or not. I know the bodies are just slightly different but I'm not sure about the door panels. Is there anyway you could get some pics of them?

What size speaker would they accommodate?

[audio-neon 34]

Yeah, there is a 360.2 amp on ebay right now. Not sure if that's really what it is supposed to be called (360.2) but its there.

I measured my mounting depth in my front doors. 2 inches with no baffle. 3 inches with stock plastic baffle. Making my own baffle I can bring it out to about 4 or 4.5 inches. 4 would be best, less likely to be kicked, and 4.5 is doable, and 5 is just pushing it. 5 would be doable if I put some good strong grilles in front of the speaker.

Is the 2000 Neon the same body style as the '03? I have a set of buildouts built into the lower door panel that I'm replacing. If you're not in a hurry I'll be back in the States in early August and would let them go for really cheap. Matching set of tweeter mounts for the a-pillar, too.

Helotaxi, let me know when you are back in the states. I have an 00 neon that will most likely end up being my next major car project.

[audio-neon 34]

Just an FYI, 2000-05 neons are all the same (including the srt-4) for speaker locations and door panels/a-pillars etc. The srt-4 just has a different gauge set and different front seats.

[helotaxi 46]

SRT-4 also has silver door pulls on the inside, but these panels are built on the regular Neon panels and have handles that match the panel color. They were made for 6.5" mids and housed CDT es-6s originally and then ES-06+s. They are painted silver to match my car/radio trim and the tweeter pods are as well. There's a pic of them somewhere, I think in the build log section, but I can't see the pics (blocked on my gov't computer).

EDIT: Pics in this thread: http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/forum/i...?showtopic=8474

[JonnieBlaze 0]

SRT-4 also has silver door pulls on the inside, but these panels are built on the regular Neon panels and have handles that match the panel color. They were made for 6.5" mids and housed CDT es-6s originally and then ES-06+s. They are painted silver to match my car/radio trim and the tweeter pods are as well. There's a pic of them somewhere, I think in the build log section, but I can't see the pics (blocked on my gov't computer).

EDIT: Pics in this thread: http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/forum/i...?showtopic=8474

Those look nice. Are the panels sealed or do they open up into the door to allow more air space? Just curious.

[helotaxi 46]

Those look nice. Are the panels sealed or do they open up into the door to allow more air space? Just curious.

They are sealed and extend through the door panel into the door. Not sure on the exact volume but they will house a CDT ES-06+ comfortably, so depth isn't an issue. They are bolted to the door plastic from the inside, so you could take them off to paint a different color or cover them in vinyl or whatever.

[Adrian_D 520]

I would go on line and find a used JBL/Crown BPX amplifier if you were after

seriously tight bass on a low budget...they have an effective damping factor

almost 20X higher than the conventional class D amplifier

The BPx is just like a regular class D amplifier. High-current servo is just a part of the marketing plan