2 systems, 1 car....discussion

[MarAha 0]

First, let me just say that I don’t know much about car audio. 95% of people on here would put me to shame so forgive me if what I’m asking is impossible. But I do know a fair bit about audio in general since I do a little mixing music on the side. So here’s what I’ve been recently thinking about…

I have a system, with ONE 12” Eclipse Titanium in a ported box tuned to about 30hz. My sub hits the lows real good up until around 60hz, but doesn’t pick up anything above that. Check this link to hear what my system picks up (it’s a clip of a song that I filtered the music out of and just left the bass that my sub picks up…you may not be able to hear it on your computer speakers unless you got a decent sub): http://p.n.p.t.aimini.net/download/?fid=tpnPw9lAGpoqldLkqGYB

1 of my friends has TWO 12” L7s in a ported box tuned to god knows what. He just paid someone to “put in a loud system” and didn’t ask any questions. His actually hits at the 60hz to 120hz, but literally picks up nothing under 60Hz. Basically, when he plays Late Night Tip (since almost everyone knows that), you pretty much only hear the kicks and midbass. It's in a pretty small box too. I'd say MAX 3cuft total for both subs which I was surprised about Check this link to hear what his picks up (same song as the first clip, but from 60hz to 120hz): http://f.o.9.5.aimini.net/download/?fid=59ofosT0Z5Oro6aulO91

So basically, we got 2 completely different sounds bass-wise. And I was thinking, why can’t I put 2 systems like that together to make 1 big beast and have it play like this?: http://u.b.d.y.aimini.net/download/?fid=ydBuw511vvZSpUngQpSz

Now I see a lot of people say “there will be cancellation” when you put different subs or speakers in different boxes and everything together in 1 car, but from my mixing knowledge, a sub that hits from 60Hz and lower, mixed with a sub that hits from 60hz to 120hz, would have no cancellation since they both pick up different frequencies. I know it requires some work to get the frequencies set right but is there any reason why this wouldn’t be possible? If it’s possible, I’m honestly thinking about putting together a system like this by the end of this year and I would like everybody’s help on here, with money not being an issue if I decide to do this. I know that you can get components that pick up bass in this range but my goal is to have this range hit real loud like the L7s do. So to summarize, 2 enclosures in 1 car. 1 hits the midbass, and 1 hits the lower bass.

These numbers are just approximations by the way. And if I’m not allowed to put clips of audio files, please let me know and I’ll edit this post.

Edited September 5, 2009 by MarAha

[antonmiller 8]

i had a discussion like this on another forum, i got flamed up and down saying that its completely wrong, but i dont think so. try it and let me know! its just like having some midbass drivers, but different....

[MarAha 0]

Well without flaming lol, I hope someone can explain why this wouldn't work. I KNOW that if you mix 2 different ranges of frequencies, there will be no cancellation. So I don't see why this wouldn't be possible.

I would just try it, but it would be such a waste of money and time if it ends up not working.

Edited September 5, 2009 by MarAha

[lithium 358]

why not get subs that can play from 30-100???

[NB50 206]

Not build up your midbass/front stage instead of putting an expensive band aid on it.

[MarAha 0]

bromo, I can't even imagine any midbass drivers that would be as loud as the 2 12's hitting at the 60hz to 120hz that I mentioned. Although I obviously want the full spectrum in my car, I would like the 120hz and lower to be LOUD and the only way I can see that happening is having the 2 enclosures. Unless I can get subs that DO get a full range like lithium mentioned but what subs actually get that type of range? From the systems I've heard so far (remember, I'm still very new to all this stuff), I've only heard the systems getting the low range like mine does, or the midbass range like my friends does, never both.

[Duran 387]

Bandpass.

[kirill007 52]

Build a tline tuned to around 38-40hz.

Or a sealed box, hits al the notes, but just not as loud as a ported box.

[antonmiller 8]

right now all you are doing is giving him alternatives, not explanations. he just wants to know why it wouldnt work. and i dont know that so i cant help any...

[KU40 173]

Sound quality gurus wouldn't like that setup because subs really shouldn't be playing above around 80 hz. If they do, they run the risk of messing up the soundstage by making the midbass noticeably behind you. Plus 95% of the time, if not higher, midbass sounds better out of an actual mid than a sub. Not to mention that ideally the best system would have one speaker play the entire frequency spectrum, and adding yet another in the line of speakers causes frequency response and phasing issues.

Otherwise there's really nothing against it. I mean if you like it you like it.

[jfin1204 2]

i would just add more front stage. i picked up some 3 way components 6.5 midbass,5.25 mids, and 1" tweeter and are gonna bridge them on my 100.4d they are 325 rms each side. i dont have any speakers in the rear just subs. if you have speaker in each door of the 4 doors i would some how move the rear speakers to the front considering you might not hear them in the rear due to the subs.

[smgreen20 3]

it would work if set up right. Yea the SQ might suffer, but it wont matter what anyone here says, you CAN mix5 different brand of 10's in the same ride. It comes down to what plays what freq. You'll need to bandpass all of the subs except for the one that you'll designate for the last set of freqs.

Example: 10" 1 plays 100-140Hz PB

10" 2 plays 80-100 Hz PB

10" 3 plays 60-80 Hz PB

10" 4 plays 40-60 Hz PB

and 10" 5 plays 40 Hz on down. LP

It's VERY unpractical to set a system up this way, but it can be done.

Now if you were to use two of those subs to play the same freqs then things will start happening. Cancellation, the sensitivity ratings on the 2, one could over power (in sound) the other one. A whole slew of things.

[MarAha 0]

smgreen20 and KU40...here's where my inexperience comes in car audio. I would think that since I'm trying to get the full range of frequencies, that means I'm trying to get better SQ except louder since I'm trying to get the 60hz to 100hz to come out loud from subs instead of midbass drivers. Can you explain why SQ would suffer? If anything, my actual plan is like this:

Enclosure 1 - 20 or 30hz - to 60hz like my current setup

Enclosure 2 - 60hz to 80 or 90hz

I'd play with these settings on the amp with the HPF and LPF to see what sounds better but that's my general idea. And then have the midbass come in with other speakers after enclosure 2 cuts off at 80 or 90. Of course I'd never mix frequencies. I work with music and I know never to mix 2 bass lines together unless I cut off the frequencies from each bassline that they both have and would try to compete for. That's why I made this topic. Because knowing that as long as 2 systems don't play the same frequencies, why not put them together to get a full range and have it LOUD instead of having 1 and just using small midbass drivers that won't hit anywhere near as loud?

Edited September 8, 2009 by MarAha

[smgreen20 3]

There's no reason why you couldn't run things that way. Just be careful when you get around the 90-100Hz area, at that freq it could start to pull the sound stage to the rear. You'll know w/o a doubt were the subs are at and you (ideally) don't want to be able to place the location of any speaker.

I know I've only got a few posts in here, but I've been in this when a lot of these so called informants were still in diapers. I'm not that old, I'll be 33 in 2 weeks, but I've been at this since around April '92. It's a passionate hobby of mine. A great stress reliever.