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http://usdaudio.com/sw/cars/ http://www.imagedynamicsusa.com/forum/index.php?app=gallery http://usdaudio.com/products/wg.php http://www.woofersetc.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.brands&category_id=24&brand_ID=36 Or, buy these: http://www.woofersetc.com/p5014/CD-HORN--Image-Dynamics-V2-Fullsize-Horn.htm And pick a compression driver from here: http://www.parts-express.com/wizards/searchResults.cfm?searchFilter=COMPRESSION+DRIVER&srchExt=&perPage=25&sortBy=1&layout=list&page=1&srchPrice=&srchCat=279&srchMfg=&srchPromo=&srchAttr= Or look for used horns in the classifieds of various forums.

If you weren't being a jackhat you'd get a response. Don't worry though I am done with your thread. Enjoy the fail.

I gave you the opportunity to let me help you with questions you have yet to answer that will really determine what I'd recommend. Can't do jack without that info and yes you are being pre-emptive. The relationship between processing (I just now know that you only have 24dB slopes from your LAST post), mounting location and aiming, along with the capability of the woofer are all extremely logical to sort out before buying anything. On top of that if you are planning to change things in the future that information should be included as well. There is NEVER any golden rule, specific guideline that always works, but instead a series of compromises that you need to outline where and what you will do that will surely help narrow down driver choices. Don't get me wrong I like the Seas Neo's, but 9 out of 10 people I see buy them use them inappropriately and are not happy.

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae183/FiBoxes/Q%20Boxes/Q12sealed1.png What's wrong with that one?

Made here vs. overseas

Horns will help the stage in several ways. First, because of where the drivers are mounted the pathlengths between the left and right compression drivers will be fairly well equalized, which is important because the frequencies the horn will be playing will still be sensitive to time arrival. Second, the controlled directivity of the horns will create a more even power response than conventional drivers in conventional setups, which is an important factor to creating an accurate soundstage. Having the majority of the midrange originate from a single source can aid in creating more coherence in the sound as it solves some issues that can occur from having a crossover point right in mist of the critical midrange frequencies. This can go a long way to improving the sound stage. The output of the horns will only be matched by using multiples of any other driver that covers the same frequency range. Having a single driver compared to several will eliminate a large portion of the constructive/destructive interference issues that occur by using multiple drivers covering the same frequency range. Eliminating those FR issues will also go a long way to improving the sound stage. Horns use the lower portion of the dash as basically an extension of the horn body itself, allowing the horns to create a nice, high sound stage even though the drivers are located lower in the vehicle. Those are just a few of the advantages. Horns can stage and image extremely well when setup properly, which is one of his goals. His other goal is to obtain high output levels, of which there is no better option than HLCD. And using horns instead of multiple drivers helps eliminate many potential issues. So, in short......horns would meet his every goal without most of the compromises of the other options, namely using multiple tweeters.

First off the pissing match is exclusively started when someone disrespects the forum. It is clear in the Terms & Conditions that there is information that should be relayed to make it an effective thread. Everyone who has had issue to this is too damn lazy to do enough research or reading to even know that. Your answer and post wasn't this way, but information was left out you didn't know was necessary. You then provided it in your post. That is more than fine Curious to know what your Uncles Vertical Symmetricals have for drivers **assuming they are speakers, not something I've heard of if its a brand. Still curious on the large format. The mounting depth is independent of the format as this has to do with the flange. For an SQ setup it is all about the driver, which was what I meant about the off axis. Most home audio drivers are designed primarily for on axis work so picking one that is appropriate for your needs we will have to take your door/kick mounting into account. Of course, this was related to my frequency response question as smaller diameter tweeters usually do better off axis. I am curious as to why the kicks won't be custom, don't you have to make them anyways? You also seem to say no to the A pillar but then offer it as a solution. If you go the A-pillar route knowing a bit more about your dash and vehicle would help as there are many that really stink for that application. Luckily your weight concern isn't really an issue, no seat of the pants or measurable difference over 10lbs here or there. Which Eclipse H/U do you have (or better yet what processing does it have)? Need to really know what it can do for processing to help as this will greatly influence both driver and location recommendations. They are COMPLETELY intertwined.

No worries, the day I stop learning is the day I die. Hope to help others continue as well.

If you read the thread, that is nearly exactly what we are recommending. You got a little lost in the details though. -no real midbass will play to 2500Hz, my favorite bang for the buck driver has a hard time hitting 300Hz which means you are compromising a bit in the driver. Nonetheless there are choices. -For systems with output as the goal, having the subs play higher is no big deal and beneficial as they are more efficient by default than anything else you can use based on cone area -ANY decent horn can play WAY below 2300Hz, some down under 1kHz even -Overlapping can be a terrible idea much more often than a good one. And no it will do the opposite from being "warmer or smoother" -RTA's really shouldn't be used EXCEPT for to find anomalies, definitely not for setting up your system. You should set it up for yourself and not for some computer -EQ in general should not be to satisfy your "wants" but to remove the anomalies. Your "wants" should be solved in your installation. -Flat sounds like ass, always -You should generically speaking never use an eq to "move up from there" but to pull things down. EQ's are for making cuts, not boost. -I would say several weeks, not hours or days. The recommendation of using a midbass or better yet a dynamically capable midrange and a horn is the ONLY solution for getting loud, maintaining a stage, and still sounding good. Multiple drivers playing high frequencies is always a bad idea and a hell of a compromise in the wrong direction. quoted You know I said the truck would stage... but I NEVER said WELL ... wtf bro ?? I would NEVER put that system in competition. So far I've read is adding horns under the dash ... nothing about driver positioning ... how is this going to help your stage ?? What do you mean by stage but not very well, that makes absolutely no sense...unless you have a seriously jacked definition of stage. The horns will help significantly for a multitude of reason. A L/R point source will ALWAYS be easier to make cohesive than multiple point sources, the horns even under the dash will be as high if not higher than the tweets in the current door, and they can actually be aimed. Basically nearly every aspect of staging will be improved over what he has currently. again, best of luck with your system bro ... Thanks, Randal .......... And again, your suggestion won't have the dynamic capability that the OP wants. One normal tweet on each side will NOT "keep up" with his subs at all. Rudimentary understanding of sensitivity and power ratings will tell you that. He will definitely still need processing AND your off axis recommendation is not good either. We already went over this though. It won't.

You know I said the truck would stage... but I NEVER said WELL ... wtf bro ?? I would NEVER put that system in competition. 1 door out of the whole system ?? I thought you were interested in the A-pillars ... I was the first one in this thread to give my oppinion and THIS was not it ... you know that. I thought we had an understanding ?? So far I've read is adding horns under the dash ... nothing about driver positioning ... how is this going to help your stage ?? I apologise for trying to help ... best of luck to ya bro on your system ... THIS was my suggestion ... several post back at the start of this thread ... again, best of luck with your system bro ... Thanks, Randal ..........

Steve Meade and Jonathon Price know nothing about staging, that's for sure. Your confusing "knowledgeable" with "YouTube Whore"

You could try to find the popular silver tahoe thats all over youtube ... That mids and highs setup can keep up with 4 18s just fine ... hint - (smd) ... You could try to find the popular blue tahoe thats all over youtube ... That mids and highs setup can keep up with 4 18s just fine ... hint - (d4s) ... I do know of a black 2500 silverado with a snug top running 16 10s (150db all day long on music) using a pair of tweeters in the As and a pair of 8s in the kicks. This setup should be able to keep up with 4 18s just fine ... No horns on any of these vehicles ... and if I remember correctly, they all stage fairly decent too ... especially the 2500 silverado ... thanks ...

OP this is what I have heard is a cheaper alternative to the Image Dynamics Horns and the route Im gonna go: (2) of these Selenium D2500Ti-Nd-8 (2) of these Image Dynamics V.2 Full-size Horn Bodies (2) of these adaptors Selenium Adaptors This will save you around 300 bucks if you ever go that route, those are the same horns pretty much as the ID's below. But when it comes to Image Dynamic HLCD the question really boils down what do you want to spend, I was gonna go with these if I went with the ID Horns: Mini-Horns Full-Size As Impious stated earlier, when it comes to mids the bigger the better and not the more the better. In my next build Im looking at either a pair of 8''s or 10"s honestly.

Choice and quality of materials, tolerances, actual experience of the people testing the drivers (if they are tested) before they ship out, fit and finish, and very little design protection, these are all issues in build houses overseas. Bar-none the #1 priority in those factories is build and move as much product as humanly possible, almost everything else takes a back seat. Yes there are competent build houses over seas, but there are always issues to deal with.

More volume = less mechanical control or something like that

Ok. This will be the last time I will respond with regard to what I have and have not answered or included. I have included ALL the components besides the sub arrangement that I am currently working with. I will not sit here and break down the specs of each component just to get some SUGGESTIONS as to what a quality SQ oriented tweeter is that would fit into my equation. All is have been asking for is suggestions. I don't need somebody to tell me I need to overhaul my entire system in order to buy a tweeter. Car audio is the land of imperfection and like I said before it's like chasing the end of a rainbow. I may buy 5 or more different drivers until I like the way things sound. Oh and then I might even get tired of the way it sounds and want to change it again. This whole discussion again was for BASIC input for a quality SQ tweeter and is turning into something completely different. Sometimes forums really suck. This all reminds me of some of the guys on the other forum I frequent. You ask what is a quality exhaust manifold to achieve XYZ and instead of offering suggestions they proceed to pick apart your modification process and tell you that you should just build the motor and tranny first which costs 10x what the exhaust does. What begins as a simple question results in somebodies mental barf bag with no conclusion. Oh my. 4xforce OUT!

My my.. Always gotta make things complicated..