No Love for Sundown!!!!

[SilkySmoove 0]

Hello all,

Here in the Raleigh, NC area I have been around to a few car audio shops to pick up little things from time to time and I notice that most do not carry any Sundown Audio equipment. To me this has been somewhat of a surprise considering the fact that the company is "local", in the sense that it is based out of the same state and is only a few hours away. The response I have gotten from guys that run these shops is almost offensive to me as a Sundown Audio user. When I ask why they don't carry any Sundown they seem to get on this defensive "high horse" stating that either "Sundown equipment is too expensive, and nobody will buy it" or that "they are just a small company that is here today and will probably be gone tomorrow......I don't want to sale my customers stuff that may not be around tomorrow."

What kind of crap is this?!?!?!..........honestly it kind of pissed me off today when I went into this shop to pick up some RCA's and the guy was just talking down on Sundown. The only logical reason I can come up with for these guys talking like this is the fact that they have NEVER experienced/used any Sundown Audio equipment personally. Jacob you and your boys might need to come to Raleigh and show some of these guys whats up!!!!

Sincerely,

A Satisfied Sundown Audio Customer

[imsolost7886 1]

had the same experience a few years ago when Resonant Engineering was still owned by scott and all them. took my sx15 to a local shop, with a pretty sad install really, and amazed the guy. he told me it was the loudest single 15 setup he had heard. was underpowered and not enough box due to a small trunk. now they have a couple shops that sell the stuff. i will soon be a proud owner of sundown equipment and yet again, it will be time to show the local community what good products are all about.

[KU40 173]

They've probably never heard of it and just trying to sell their own stuff. No reason to get offended, it's just what all shops do.

[Sir-Lancelot 216]

Different strokes for different folks.

Sundown gets plenty of love.

[smullen 1]

To the OP, this is the main reason that 98% of what I buy comes from someplace online... Be it direct from the manufacture or whatever.... I've been into Car Audio longer than some of you have been driving and I've bought stuff from the local joints 6-7 times vs the hundreds I've bought online...

Same goes for my Firearms, the gunshops only sell items they make the highest margin on....

But, to be Devils advocate, What is any business in business for??? To make profit, pay the shops rent, bills, their/their employees salary, etc... They gotta do what they think they gotta do to Survive...

Sucks as I'd rather buy everything local...

[sundownz 197]

The funny thing is we are one of the most dealer friendly companies out there... I get alot of crap on the net about being "overpriced" since we actually defend profits for our dealers.

You can buy most brands on e-bay for dealer cost... guess what ? All Sundown sold online is at MAP pricing -- a level that dealers can make money at.

If they choose to carry products that cut the throats of the shops selling them so be it.

Dealers that do carry our line are quite pleased.

[SilkySmoove 0]

To the OP, this is the main reason that 98% of what I buy comes from someplace online... Be it direct from the manufacture or whatever.... I've been into Car Audio longer than some of you have been driving and I've bought stuff from the local joints 6-7 times vs the hundreds I've bought online...

Same goes for my Firearms, the gunshops only sell items they make the highest margin on....

But, to be Devils advocate, What is any business in business for??? To make profit, pay the shops rent, bills, their/their employees salary, etc... They gotta do what they think they gotta do to Survive...

Sucks as I'd rather buy everything local...

I'm the same way as far as buying the vast majority of my stuff online or directly from the manufacturer. But at the same time, like you said, I would like to support the local shops if only they did not charge crazy prices for stuff. For example, the shop I went to today, where the guy was ragging on Sundown, I asked about pricing on getting a box built just out of pure curiosity and he told me that pricing starts at $150 and can exceed $500. In my mind I was thinking that's pretty expensive for something I can buy the materials and do myself for $30. But at the same time I realize that it is a business and they need to make a profit. Here comes the kicker though...........I ask the guy if he had a sample box I could take a look at and he flared up saying "I don't let anybody see the inside of my boxes without purchasing one from me because I do special stuff to them like........" Then I said to him "don't you think that mentality possibly hurts your business?" His response: "You just have to have confidence in me........." Now who in their RIGHT MIND is going to plop down a few hundred bucks on something without having an opportunity to see the quality of the work they are paying for?!?!?! What a jerk. Just know that I will NEVER be going back to that place again.

I know that example was off topic lol, so back to the subject at hand. I still feel like these local guys should show some love to a quality company that is pretty much in their back yard.

[SilkySmoove 0]

The funny thing is we are one of the most dealer friendly companies out there... I get alot of crap on the net about being "overpriced" since we actually defend profits for our dealers.

You can buy most brands on e-bay for dealer cost... guess what ? All Sundown sold online is at MAP pricing -- a level that dealers can make money at.

If they choose to carry products that cut the throats of the shops selling them so be it.

Dealers that do carry our line are quite pleased.

Thanks for the reply Jacob. It just kind of caught me off guard how these guys got sooooo defensive when I asked them why they didn't carry Sundown. Almost as if they felt I was taking a swipe at them for not doing so. I just think that Raleigh is ripe for the picking, especially with all of the college kids around here if one of these shops would carry Sundown products.

Their response to buying the same stuff they carry online for the low low is that "you can't be certain that it is the genuine product, plus you don't get the warranty you would get if you bought through us.........." That's the crap that they feed to people who don't know much about car audio and get conned into paying the high prices they charge. I'm just glad I know better lol

Edited August 28, 2010 by SilkySmoove

[Sir-Lancelot 216]

No actually if you do buy local and you blow something up, 99% of them replace the product.

There are advantages to buying local, but price is not one of them.

[SilkySmoove 0]

No actually if you do buy local and you blow something up, 99% of them replace the product.

There are advantages to buying local, but price is not one of them.

Oh, I'm not denying that point of their service. They are most definitely good for that.

[sundownz 197]

We allow our dealers to replace amplifiers over the counter at their discretion and we will in turn replace it for the dealer. We end up replacing alot of things that are purely user error for local dealers so they can "help out" their customers.

Obviously for subs its a bit different as a completely black coil is really no question *laughs*

[SilkySmoove 0]

We allow our dealers to replace amplifiers over the counter at their discretion and we will in turn replace it for the dealer. We end up replacing alot of things that are purely user error for local dealers so they can "help out" their customers.

Obviously for subs its a bit different as a completely black coil is really no question *laughs*

I guess that's still not good enough for these guys lol

[socialstealth 0]

I believe what the dealer(s) were trying to say is that compared to major companies and corporations, sundown is a small company. I don't think sundown is incorporated, which means if anything happens to jacob, Sundown goes poof.

Although I'm a big fan of sundown, I think your local dealers have a point. If they sell a kicker amp, and someone has a problem with their kicker amp and brings it back to the shop, the shop knows that they can either fix the amp and get reimbersed by kicker or just send the amp back to kicker and get a refund on it. Although they could do the same thing with Sundown at this moment, If sundown is bought out or goes out of business, the shop won't be able to go to them for warranty information.

Now I know that sounds a little hostile against sundown, but theres really no way to tell how it would play out, until it plays out. So the shop owner has a valid point.

As for him getting angry, Imagine if someone walked into your store and said why don't you carry xxx brand, I won't buy your stuff because you don't sell xxx brand, xxx brand is better. Its like a kick in the balls, and if anyone else is around to hear you I bet they're going to go home and look up xxx brand instead of buying something right away. Just not a good issue to press.

[SilkySmoove 0]

I believe what the dealer(s) were trying to say is that compared to major companies and corporations, sundown is a small company. I don't think sundown is incorporated, which means if anything happens to jacob, Sundown goes poof.

Although I'm a big fan of sundown, I think your local dealers have a point. If they sell a kicker amp, and someone has a problem with their kicker amp and brings it back to the shop, the shop knows that they can either fix the amp and get reimbersed by kicker or just send the amp back to kicker and get a refund on it. Although they could do the same thing with Sundown at this moment, If sundown is bought out or goes out of business, the shop won't be able to go to them for warranty information.

Now I know that sounds a little hostile against sundown, but theres really no way to tell how it would play out, until it plays out. So the shop owner has a valid point.

As for him getting angry, Imagine if someone walked into your store and said why don't you carry xxx brand, I won't buy your stuff because you don't sell xxx brand, xxx brand is better. Its like a kick in the balls, and if anyone else is around to hear you I bet they're going to go home and look up xxx brand instead of buying something right away. Just not a good issue to press.

I fully understand what you are saying, and I'm not denying the perceived stability of the "larger/more established companies". As for asking about carrying brand xxx, I did not do it in a hostile or out of line manner. It was just part of our conversation, and I simply asked "why don't you carry Sundown since they are more or less a local company?"..........then the guy flipped lol. He got up on his soap box for a good minute with his long winded explanation.

[sundownz 197]

IMO - being that we have been around now for 4 years and simply continue to grow the "small company" excuse is just that. Most likely they simply haven't heard of us at all and wanted to sell you something they have in stock.

[thecartel 0]

Ok being I just open a shop a few months ago. A this time I don't carry Sundown but I do run all Sundown in my car. The only reason I'm not carring Sundown is The buy-in. Its not that its high But at the same time We are a small shop and can't have a bunch of equiment sitting on a shelf. People around here never heard of Sundown and people seem to want what every one else has. I can sell the SA's For the same price as a Kicker CVR but every one want the CVR's becaused there friend has one. Sundown will be in my shop soon but its going to have to wait until after we move to a better location in Sept.

[REVpuggie 23]

Ok being I just open a shop a few months ago. A this time I don't carry Sundown but I do run all Sundown in my car. The only reason I'm not carring Sundown is The buy-in. Its not that its high But at the same time We are a small shop and can't have a bunch of equiment sitting on a shelf. People around here never heard of Sundown and people seem to want what every one else has. I can sell the SA's For the same price as a Kicker CVR but every one want the CVR's becaused there friend has one. Sundown will be in my shop soon but its going to have to wait until after we move to a better location in Sept.

when just one local guy has it others will follow ... people want want they've heared and know it will sound good / get stupid loud .

[smullen 1]

Ok being I just open a shop a few months ago. A this time I don't carry Sundown but I do run all Sundown in my car. The only reason I'm not carring Sundown is The buy-in. Its not that its high But at the same time We are a small shop and can't have a bunch of equiment sitting on a shelf. People around here never heard of Sundown and people seem to want what every one else has. I can sell the SA's For the same price as a Kicker CVR but every one want the CVR's becaused there friend has one. Sundown will be in my shop soon but its going to have to wait until after we move to a better location in Sept.

Sounds like someone needs to do a build that REALLY gets peoples attention and shows what Sundown can do... Coupe of nice displays in the shop will help too...

Props on owning a shop, big or small... I've awlays wanted to own one, but I'll freely admidt, I don't have the install skillz...

[Impious 1,476]

Most likely they simply haven't heard of us at all

You just proved their point for them. If the shop hasn't heard of Sundown, how many of their customer base has?

Ideally a business will carry what products their customers demand. If five guys a year walk in and ask why they don't carry some relatively small brand that's right down the road, and five hundred people walk in the door asking for MTX/Kicker/Etc, what do you think is going to give the shop the most sales? You could try to make the argument that if they carried Sundown they could offer it and possible sell it to some of those other 500 customers....but then all you're doing is making the salespersons job more difficult. Admittedly some will be "converted" to the different brand, but the majority probably won't be willing to take a chance on the unknown and potentially think the salesman is blowing smoke, reducing their credibility and potentially losing what otherwise would have been a sale. And there are disadvantages to taking the chance and stocking the product....they have the inventory carrying costs which ties up capital that could be spent elsewhere (since inventory will potentially move slowly for an unfamiliar brand), you have the time in product training, you have the time in updating the computer systems, you have the difficulty of trying to sell unfamiliar product A over familiar product B to the customers, etc. It's not "free" to the shop to pick up a new brand, especially one that will potentially have poor sales due to limited brand awareness.

It's great you've been in business for 4 years and continue to grow. But frankly in the grand scheme of things, you're still pretty small. Most of the major brands that are carried by these shops likely sell more nationally in a couple weeks than Sundown does in a year. Is that a knock on Sundown? No, it's just a fact. Brand awareness is a pretty important factor, and those brands have much greater awareness in the masses. And I would probably have to take off my shoes to count the number of smaller car audio companies I've watched fail over the years. How long was Adire, for example, in business? At least 4 years I'm sure, and they toppled. Sundown is not immune.

My point isn't to look like I'm bashing Sundown, but rather point out that it's a little ridiculous to chastise a shop for not carrying Sundown or any other smaller company. The businesses have to weigh the risk/reward for doing such, and many of them at this juncture probably due not foresee enough of a payoff.

EDIT: I didn't read thecartel's response before posting, but it looks like he pretty much proves my point.

[SilkySmoove 0]

Impious and thecartel, I completely agree and understand the business standpoint of having to weigh multiple factors when deciding what products to carry/sale. However, my issue with these shop owners is them getting up on their soapbox, so to speak, and talking down as if someone went out of their way to offend them. My genuine inquiry as to why they don't carry Sundown could have simply been answered by "the demand in the area at the moment does not justify us carrying it." Not a rant going in on the company...............I know, nothing to be offended by on my end, but it just caught me off guard a little.

[cheese20323 13]

This use to happen to my local RE dealer, They carried RE but they didn't sell they just sold kicker jl etc then one of the workers left one day and he had 2 XXX's and they felt the doors rattling with all the bass the customer wanted them so after a year that guy recommend RE then leading them to have a demo car with nothing but Us amps and RE and our whole city is filled with RE. So what I'm saying is say have your car(s) with sundown stuff and demo them i doubt any kicker stuff is better than sundown..........

[thecartel 0]

This use to happen to my local RE dealer, They carried RE but they didn't sell they just sold kicker jl etc then one of the workers left one day and he had 2 XXX's and they felt the doors rattling with all the bass the customer wanted them so after a year that guy recommend RE then leading them to have a demo car with nothing but Us amps and RE and our whole city is filled with RE. So what I'm saying is say have your car(s) with sundown stuff and demo them i doubt any kicker stuff is better than sundown..........

My car is all sundown and people that just come by to hear it. But at the same time people like to stick with what they know. The best selling product in the shop are the Crunch ground pounder sub 100 for a 12" and Audio pipe 1500 for 250 So for alittle more then 500 they can have a system. The Sundown 1500 would cost that alone. 90% of the people that come into the shop don't care about TL number they just want the trunk to rattle. Alot of them just get in the car turn it up and get out to see how much it rattles. I will add Sundown but I need to grow alittle more so if it doesn't sell Quick atless it won't hurt my bottom line. Beside If it stay in the shop to long I would to fight myself not to put it my car....lol

[Kanaworm$ 292]

Ok being I just open a shop a few months ago. A this time I don't carry Sundown but I do run all Sundown in my car. The only reason I'm not carring Sundown is The buy-in. Its not that its high But at the same time We are a small shop and can't have a bunch of equiment sitting on a shelf. People around here never heard of Sundown and people seem to want what every one else has. I can sell the SA's For the same price as a Kicker CVR but every one want the CVR's becaused there friend has one. Sundown will be in my shop soon but its going to have to wait until after we move to a better location in Sept.

The "Buy In" is very respectable and Sundown is very lenient on the monthly terms. Not sure how you cannot stock any product!

If you run the Sundown product how can you not stock anything? All it takes is a small system to get peoples attention.

[jcarter1885 995]

This use to happen to my local RE dealer, They carried RE but they didn't sell they just sold kicker jl etc then one of the workers left one day and he had 2 XXX's and they felt the doors rattling with all the bass the customer wanted them so after a year that guy recommend RE then leading them to have a demo car with nothing but Us amps and RE and our whole city is filled with RE. So what I'm saying is say have your car(s) with sundown stuff and demo them i doubt any kicker stuff is better than sundown..........

My car is all sundown and people that just come by to hear it. But at the same time people like to stick with what they know. The best selling product in the shop are the Crunch ground pounder sub 100 for a 12" and Audio pipe 1500 for 250 So for alittle more then 500 they can have a system. The Sundown 1500 would cost that alone. 90% of the people that come into the shop don't care about TL number they just want the trunk to rattle. Alot of them just get in the car turn it up and get out to see how much it rattles. I will add Sundown but I need to grow alittle more so if it doesn't sell Quick atless it won't hurt my bottom line. Beside If it stay in the shop to long I would to fight myself not to put it my car....lol

x2 Completely agreed, guys remember all of us in the beginning thought $500 for an amp or subs is expensive and wouldnt pay it (some still think the same way while others got over it). My friends nowadays want systems but want it done as cheap as possible, they see my sundown equipment and ask me to sell it. When i give them a price they change there mind or be like how much was it, when I tell them the price I got it for there jaws just drop. Everybody in car audio doesnt care about the best brand, some dont even treat this like a hobby while most do it just to have some bass in the whip. Other people have other hobbies, bills, family and collectibles to spend there money on instead of car audio like others.

[thecartel 0]

Ok being I just open a shop a few months ago. A this time I don't carry Sundown but I do run all Sundown in my car. The only reason I'm not carring Sundown is The buy-in. Its not that its high But at the same time We are a small shop and can't have a bunch of equiment sitting on a shelf. People around here never heard of Sundown and people seem to want what every one else has. I can sell the SA's For the same price as a Kicker CVR but every one want the CVR's becaused there friend has one. Sundown will be in my shop soon but its going to have to wait until after we move to a better location in Sept.

The "Buy In" is very respectable and Sundown is very lenient on the monthly terms. Not sure how you cannot stock any product!

If you run the Sundown product how can you not stock anything? All it takes is a small system to get peoples attention.

When you have a shop as small as mine. Then you carry what sells. I have all the paper work to become a dealer. And its not the buy-in, its the fact that if I do order it. It will sit around for months. Small shop need to have a fast turn around. Not only do I have all the bills for the shop that need to be paid, there are still the bills at home that need to be paid also. I need to make a profit everyday so I can keep the doors open and food on the table. So I can't have 2-3k worth on stuff just sitting around. When you have 1 bay and your stock room is your show room then you got to do good work and you got to have a inventory that move. Just because you like brand doesn't mean its something that you need to carry. Shop owner pick the brand that sells the best for them. I would like to carry brand like Sundown, DC, IA and some other but they just wouldn't sell fast. And I need to keep my over head low until this shop is off the ground.